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19 million on minimum wage..how can that be


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2 hours ago, mudgirl said:

Hey, Gringohombre, if you are interested in facts (which it is quite obvious you aren't), you could start with very simple self-education. 

Try looking up "Socialism" on Wikipedia, and clicking on the "History" section. 

Here's how it starts:

"Socialist models and ideas espousing common or public ownership have existed since antiquity."

 

Yes, in the Nunnery this works fine...but in real life not so good...look at the history. I could recommend many books the spell it out in great detail but of course those who have been brainwashed and bamboozled would not be interested in learning about FOCTS!!! 

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2 hours ago, gringohombre said:

Yes, in the Nunnery this works fine...but in real life not so good...look at the history. I could recommend many books the spell it out in great detail but of course those who have been brainwashed and bamboozled would not be interested in learning about FOCTS!!! 

A perfect example of psychological projection. You are actually describing yourself. Wake up to reality which includes focts not right wing propaganda which is based on fantasy.

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2 hours ago, AlanMexicali said:

A perfect example of psychological projection. You are actually describing yourself. Wake up to reality which includes facts not right wing propaganda which is based on fantasy.

Gobbledygook!!! Let's deal in reality here, not some sort of word stew that is not based on repudiation of FOCTS as I have presented regarding the EVIL of Socialism. If you are a Socialist, fine...just admit and let's move on!!!

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Besides the fact that I don't know of any socialists who also believe in the totalitarianism practiced by those some call 'socialist regimes, none would also do other than to condemn those regimes as horrible!

While not at all perfect (I have yet to find one that is when describing any politican ideology.), I suggest viewing "The Big Scary 'S' Word."

It is avaiailable for free viewing on Kanopy, a service provided by many public libraries.

I also suggest a conversation with Sue!

A day in the life of Sue, a Republican
Sue gets up at 6 a.m. and fills her coffeepot with water to prepare her morning coffee. The water is clean and good because some tree-hugging liberal fought for minimum water-quality standards.
With her first swallow of coffee, she takes her daily medication. Her medications are safe to take because some stupid commie liberal fought to insure their safety and that they work as advertised.
All but $10 of her medications are paid for by her employer's medical plan because some liberal union workers fought their employers for paid medical insurance - now Sue gets it too.
She prepares her morning breakfast, bacon and eggs. Sue's bacon is safe to eat because some girly-man liberal fought for laws to regulate the meat packing industry.
In the shower, Sue reaches for her shampoo. Her bottle is properly labeled with each ingredient and its amount in the total contents because some crybaby liberal fought for her right to know what she was putting on her body and how much it contained.
Sue dresses, walks outside and takes a deep breath. The air she breathes is clean because some environmentalist wacko liberal fought for laws to stop industries from polluting our air.
She walks to the subway station for her government-subsidized ride to work. It saves her considerable money in parking and transportation fees because some fancy-pants liberal fought for affordable public transportation, which gives everyone the opportunity to be a contributor.
Sue begins her work day. She has a good job with excellent pay, medical benefits, retirement, paid holidays and vacation because some lazy liberal union members fought and died for these working standards. Sue's employer pays these standards because Sue's employer doesn't want his employees to call the union.
If Sue is hurt on the job or becomes unemployed, she'll get a worker compensation or unemployment check because some stupid liberal didn't think she should lose her home because of her temporary misfortune.
Its noon and Sue needs to make a bank deposit so she can pay some bills. Sue's deposit is federally insured by the FSLIC because some godless liberal wanted to protect Sue's money from unscrupulous bankers who ruined the banking system before the Great Depression.
Sue has to pay her Fannie Mae-underwritten mortgage and her below-market federal student loan because some elitist liberal decided that Sue and the government would be better off if she was educated and earned more money over her lifetime.
Sue is home from work. She plans to visit her father this evening at his farm home in the country. She gets in her car for the drive. Her car is among the safest in the world because some America-hating liberal fought for car safety standards.
She arrives at her childhood home. Her generation was the third to live in the house financed by Farmers' Home Administration because bankers didn't want to make rural loans. The house didn't have electricity until some big-government liberal stuck his nose where it didn't belong and demanded rural electrification.
She is happy to see her father, who is now retired. Her father lives on Social Security and a union pension because some wine-drinking, cheese-eating liberal made sure he could take care of himself so Sue wouldn't have to.
Sue gets back in her car for the ride home, and turns on a radio talk show. The radio host keeps saying that liberals are bad and conservatives are good. He doesn't mention that Republicans have fought against every protection and benefit Sue enjoys throughout her day. Sue agrees: "We don't need those big-government liberals ruining our lives!
"After all, I'm self-made and believe everyone should take care of themselves, just like I have".
 
 
 

 

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2 hours ago, gringohombre said:

Gobbledygook!!! Let's deal in reality here, not some sort of word stew that is not based on repudiation of FOCTS as I have presented regarding the EVIL of Socialism. If you are a Socialist, fine...just admit and let's move on!!!

You really do not have a clue - do you?

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51 minutes ago, NLU said:

Besides the fact that I don't know of any socialists who also believe in the totalitarianism practiced by those some call 'socialist regimes, none would also do other than to condemn those regimes as horrible!

While not at all perfect (I have yet to find one that is when describing any politican ideology.), I suggest viewing "The Big Scary 'S' Word."

It is avaiailable for free viewing on Kanopy, a service provided by many public libraries.

I also suggest a conversation with Sue!

A day in the life of Sue, a Republican
Sue gets up at 6 a.m. and fills her coffeepot with water to prepare her morning coffee. The water is clean and good because some tree-hugging liberal fought for minimum water-quality standards.
With her first swallow of coffee, she takes her daily medication. Her medications are safe to take because some stupid commie liberal fought to insure their safety and that they work as advertised.
All but $10 of her medications are paid for by her employer's medical plan because some liberal union workers fought their employers for paid medical insurance - now Sue gets it too.
She prepares her morning breakfast, bacon and eggs. Sue's bacon is safe to eat because some girly-man liberal fought for laws to regulate the meat packing industry.
In the shower, Sue reaches for her shampoo. Her bottle is properly labeled with each ingredient and its amount in the total contents because some crybaby liberal fought for her right to know what she was putting on her body and how much it contained.
Sue dresses, walks outside and takes a deep breath. The air she breathes is clean because some environmentalist wacko liberal fought for laws to stop industries from polluting our air.
She walks to the subway station for her government-subsidized ride to work. It saves her considerable money in parking and transportation fees because some fancy-pants liberal fought for affordable public transportation, which gives everyone the opportunity to be a contributor.
Sue begins her work day. She has a good job with excellent pay, medical benefits, retirement, paid holidays and vacation because some lazy liberal union members fought and died for these working standards. Sue's employer pays these standards because Sue's employer doesn't want his employees to call the union.
If Sue is hurt on the job or becomes unemployed, she'll get a worker compensation or unemployment check because some stupid liberal didn't think she should lose her home because of her temporary misfortune.
Its noon and Sue needs to make a bank deposit so she can pay some bills. Sue's deposit is federally insured by the FSLIC because some godless liberal wanted to protect Sue's money from unscrupulous bankers who ruined the banking system before the Great Depression.
Sue has to pay her Fannie Mae-underwritten mortgage and her below-market federal student loan because some elitist liberal decided that Sue and the government would be better off if she was educated and earned more money over her lifetime.
Sue is home from work. She plans to visit her father this evening at his farm home in the country. She gets in her car for the drive. Her car is among the safest in the world because some America-hating liberal fought for car safety standards.
She arrives at her childhood home. Her generation was the third to live in the house financed by Farmers' Home Administration because bankers didn't want to make rural loans. The house didn't have electricity until some big-government liberal stuck his nose where it didn't belong and demanded rural electrification.
She is happy to see her father, who is now retired. Her father lives on Social Security and a union pension because some wine-drinking, cheese-eating liberal made sure he could take care of himself so Sue wouldn't have to.
Sue gets back in her car for the ride home, and turns on a radio talk show. The radio host keeps saying that liberals are bad and conservatives are good. He doesn't mention that Republicans have fought against every protection and benefit Sue enjoys throughout her day. Sue agrees: "We don't need those big-government liberals ruining our lives!
"After all, I'm self-made and believe everyone should take care of themselves, just like I have".
 
 
 

 

WHAAAAAAT!!! Tell that to the poor, miserable, downtrodden folks of Venezuela, Cuba and other countries in the world victimized by Socialism!!! The US is not a Socialist country...YET...neither is México...YET!!! What you are talking about is what a well run CAPITALIST country does...let the people be FREE to run thier own lives and have a LIMITED elected government provide certain services that the electorate approves of...not FORCED INTO!!!

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for anyoe interested the tomatoes and cranberry pickers in Poncitlan make 2000 pesos a week, they get 2 free meals a day, free ride from Chapala by company bus to work and IMSS. They are not the worse off around here.

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2 hours ago, gringohombre said:

Gobbledygook!!! Let's deal in reality here, not some sort of word stew that is not based on repudiation of FOCTS as I have presented regarding the EVIL of Socialism. If you are a Socialist, fine...just admit and let's move on!!!

 

20 minutes ago, AlanMexicali said:

You really do not have a clue - do you?

 

7 minutes ago, gringohombre said:

Again...someone here posting a derogatory post without any backup or facts!!! Just proves WHO does not have a clue!!! 

I replied to your same narrow minded selective propaganda 11 days ago on another thread you infiltrated with the exact same comments as here you are fruitlessly trying very hard to sell again but you ignored me.

See here: 

"  On 3/6/2022 at 11:28 PM, gringohombre said:

Socialism is evil!!! There is no form that is good. Some talk of democratic socialism...what an oxymoron!!! Socialism took Russia to where it is today, at the point of starting WW3. Socialism took us to WW2 as Hitler took charge under the banner of  National Socialist German Workers' Party. Castro took Cuba under the socialist flag. Hugo Chavez an avowed socialist took Venezuela, the most prosperous and democratic country in South America, to the depths of poverty and despair it is at today. And now there are actual ascending parties in the US and Canada trying to gain POWER under this name!!! God help us all!!! " 

 

     My reply to you 11 days ago:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.politico.eu/article/spain-pedro-sanchez-socialist-stronghold/amp/

You claim:  "Socialism is evil!!! There is no form that is good. Some talk of democratic socialism...what an oxymoron!!!"

 

Your hasty judgements are only mentioning fascist regimes and dictatorships which won in a democratic election with their propaganda and later became dictators and communist dictatorships. No mention of social democracies in Europe which thrive like in Spain.

 


"OPINION
Spain: Europe’s socialist torchbearer
Prime Minister Pedro Sánchez’s economic policies offer a model for the European left.

Jacob Soll is university professor and professor of philosophy, history and accounting at Dornsife College at the University of Southern California. He is the author of “The Reckoning: Financial Accountability and the Rise and Fall of Nations.” 

There is a common impression in European politics that social democracy is all but dead. In France, the once triumphant and powerful Socialist Party has practically disappeared. In Germany, after having gone so far as to govern with the conservative Christian Democratic Union, the Social Democratic Party risks being displaced by the Greens as the leading party on the left. But in Spain, there’s a different story.

Since coming into power, Prime Minister Pedro Sánchez’s Spanish Socialist Worker’s Party has overcome what has been a near universal challenge for Europe’s social democrats: avoiding a disconnect with working people.


Sánchez took power in June 2018 after forcing a no-confidence vote that ousted conservative Prime Minister Mariano Rajoy. Rocked by corruption scandals and Catalan separatism, Spain had reached a political stalemate and an unprecedented institutional crisis, as the right’s approach to governing had left the country suffering some of the worst wealth inequality in Europe.

Sánchez was able to form a coalition with the leftist Podemos party, which was supported in parliament by small parties, including a Catalonian pro-independence party. With these protest parties — which previously sought to work outside of Spain’s constitutional framework — now able to constructively enter the government, the Socialists became the party of democratic compromise, and the only recourse for those looking for a return to societal calm.

By rejecting austerity from the get-go, Sánchez has kept the party connected to working people, women and voters outside of the major urban centers. Meanwhile, his government has prioritized more funds in areas such as health care, education and equal pay, and insisted that all policies meet ecological standards and goals. Thus, not only has the left maintained its voting base and crucial social investment, it has also avoided the rise of a competing Green party.

With the COVID-19 pandemic, there is a growing international consensus that income inequality and lack of social investment undermine economies. And Sánchez has set out to address Spain’s inequality by investing in Spanish economic development to build out of the crisis, also calling for what he likened to a modern Marshall Fund for the EU.

His government used its own COVID response budget to decrease poverty, with a majority of those positively affected being women. It has also raised the minimum wage by 29 percent since 2018, passed a law to give permanent contracts to many temporary government workers and with its “Riders Law,” extended full labor rights to gig economy workers, going so far as to make sure they have access to understanding the algorithms that control their work and wages. As a result, wages have risen for nearly 240,000 people.

At the same time, the government is also aiming to help small and medium businesses, which account for 70 percent of all employment. Smaller companies sometimes struggle to adopt technology to remain competitive and transition to more sustainable models. Helping these businesses to scale up, with €4.5 billion earmarked to help modernize 1.5 million companies with digital transformation, is about making a modern, progressive economy.


The government is also focusing on supporting entrepreneurship by easing bankruptcy laws and scaling down bureaucracy. In other words, Sánchez is helping Spanish companies make long-term strategic, technological and operational investments, which they could not otherwise afford to make.

The Swedish economist Gunnar Myrdal won the 1974 Nobel Prize for showing that markets often leave out large swaths of the population — meaning that for markets to work, societies have to remove barriers of entry. In Spain, this has taken the form of providing money for the poor, removing burdensome regulations for small businesses and restoring social stability in Catalonia.

So far, Sánchez’s plans appear to be working. Spain’s 2022 growth forecast is the highest in the EU, and the country is currently one of the world leaders in COVID vaccination rates.

Amid all the talk around the decline of European social democracy, under Sánchez, the Spanish left is a success. European progressives should take a closer look. As the economic consensus moves from austerity toward social investment, the party’s achievements provide a blueprint for social democratic parties across Europe to renew their commitment to working voters, counter nationalist and populist politics and put progress back on the European agenda."

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1 hour ago, AlanMexicali said:

replied to your same narrow minded selective propaganda 11 days ago on another thread you infiltrated with the exact same comments as here you are fruitlessly trying very hard to sell again but you ignored me.

Wasting your time, Alan. His brain is programmed to endlessly repeat false right wing talking points, shut itself down to any information which does not support that, and he obviously wants to keep things that way. 

Ignorance coupled with arrogance is a really bad combination.

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5 hours ago, mudgirl said:

Wasting your time, Alan. His brain is programmed to endlessly repeat false right wing talking points, shut itself down to any information which does not support that, and he obviously wants to keep things that way. 

Ignorance coupled with arrogance is a really bad combination.

Here come the Nun...here come the Nun...Here come the Nun!!!

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2 hours ago, AlanMexicali said:

 

 

I replied to your same narrow minded selective propaganda 11 days ago on another thread you infiltrated with the exact same comments as here you are fruitlessly trying very hard to sell again but you ignored me.

See here: 

"  On 3/6/2022 at 11:28 PM, gringohombre said:

Socialism is evil!!! There is no form that is good. Some talk of democratic socialism...what an oxymoron!!! Socialism took Russia to where it is today, at the point of starting WW3. Socialism took us to WW2 as Hitler took charge under the banner of  National Socialist German Workers' Party. Castro took Cuba under the socialist flag. Hugo Chavez an avowed socialist took Venezuela, the most prosperous and democratic country in South America, to the depths of poverty and despair it is at today. And now there are actual ascending parties in the US and Canada trying to gain POWER under this name!!! God help us all!!! " 

 

     My reply to you 11 days ago:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.politico.eu/article/spain-pedro-sanchez-socialist-stronghold/amp/

You claim:  "Socialism is evil!!! There is no form that is good. Some talk of democratic socialism...what an oxymoron!!!"

 

Your hasty judgements are only mentioning fascist regimes and dictatorships which won in a democratic election with their propaganda and later became dictators and communist dictatorships. No mention of social democracies in Europe which thrive like in Spain.

 


"OPINION
Spain: Europe’s socialist torchbearer
Prime Minister Pedro Sánchez’s economic policies offer a model for the European left.

Jacob Soll is university professor and professor of philosophy, history and accounting at Dornsife College at the University of Southern California. He is the author of “The Reckoning: Financial Accountability and the Rise and Fall of Nations.” 

There is a common impression in European politics that social democracy is all but dead. In France, the once triumphant and powerful Socialist Party has practically disappeared. In Germany, after having gone so far as to govern with the conservative Christian Democratic Union, the Social Democratic Party risks being displaced by the Greens as the leading party on the left. But in Spain, there’s a different story.

Since coming into power, Prime Minister Pedro Sánchez’s Spanish Socialist Worker’s Party has overcome what has been a near universal challenge for Europe’s social democrats: avoiding a disconnect with working people.


Sánchez took power in June 2018 after forcing a no-confidence vote that ousted conservative Prime Minister Mariano Rajoy. Rocked by corruption scandals and Catalan separatism, Spain had reached a political stalemate and an unprecedented institutional crisis, as the right’s approach to governing had left the country suffering some of the worst wealth inequality in Europe.

Sánchez was able to form a coalition with the leftist Podemos party, which was supported in parliament by small parties, including a Catalonian pro-independence party. With these protest parties — which previously sought to work outside of Spain’s constitutional framework — now able to constructively enter the government, the Socialists became the party of democratic compromise, and the only recourse for those looking for a return to societal calm.

By rejecting austerity from the get-go, Sánchez has kept the party connected to working people, women and voters outside of the major urban centers. Meanwhile, his government has prioritized more funds in areas such as health care, education and equal pay, and insisted that all policies meet ecological standards and goals. Thus, not only has the left maintained its voting base and crucial social investment, it has also avoided the rise of a competing Green party.

With the COVID-19 pandemic, there is a growing international consensus that income inequality and lack of social investment undermine economies. And Sánchez has set out to address Spain’s inequality by investing in Spanish economic development to build out of the crisis, also calling for what he likened to a modern Marshall Fund for the EU.

His government used its own COVID response budget to decrease poverty, with a majority of those positively affected being women. It has also raised the minimum wage by 29 percent since 2018, passed a law to give permanent contracts to many temporary government workers and with its “Riders Law,” extended full labor rights to gig economy workers, going so far as to make sure they have access to understanding the algorithms that control their work and wages. As a result, wages have risen for nearly 240,000 people.

At the same time, the government is also aiming to help small and medium businesses, which account for 70 percent of all employment. Smaller companies sometimes struggle to adopt technology to remain competitive and transition to more sustainable models. Helping these businesses to scale up, with €4.5 billion earmarked to help modernize 1.5 million companies with digital transformation, is about making a modern, progressive economy.


The government is also focusing on supporting entrepreneurship by easing bankruptcy laws and scaling down bureaucracy. In other words, Sánchez is helping Spanish companies make long-term strategic, technological and operational investments, which they could not otherwise afford to make.

The Swedish economist Gunnar Myrdal won the 1974 Nobel Prize for showing that markets often leave out large swaths of the population — meaning that for markets to work, societies have to remove barriers of entry. In Spain, this has taken the form of providing money for the poor, removing burdensome regulations for small businesses and restoring social stability in Catalonia.

So far, Sánchez’s plans appear to be working. Spain’s 2022 growth forecast is the highest in the EU, and the country is currently one of the world leaders in COVID vaccination rates.

Amid all the talk around the decline of European social democracy, under Sánchez, the Spanish left is a success. European progressives should take a closer look. As the economic consensus moves from austerity toward social investment, the party’s achievements provide a blueprint for social democratic parties across Europe to renew their commitment to working voters, counter nationalist and populist politics and put progress back on the European agenda."

Spain is not a true Socialist country...yet!!! Sn. Google: "The politics of Spain takes place under the framework established by the Constitution of 1978. Spain is established as a social and democratic sovereign country wherein the national sovereignty is vested in the people, from which the powers of the state emanate."

A social and democratic country is not Socialist. You cannot conflate Democracy and Socialism as I have said before...two different worlds. If you want to an example of true Socialism why not choose a country just south of here: Venezuela. Chavez was elected 3 times and took a very very prosperous and oil rich Democratic country and ran it off the cliff after running out of other people's money (thank you Margaret Thatcher, a great Conservative UK Prime Minister), and it has gotten even worse under his hand picked successor. I am a little surprised that there would be so many Socialists here, even though they do not seem to want to call themselves that!!!  

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3 hours ago, Ferret said:

Let's just get to the real question...would you prefer to live in a Socialist or a Democratic country? I think you know MY answer...and please do not try to conflate the two, because that is how the EVIL evolution begins...see exhibit A, not far from here...Venezuela!!!    

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3 minutes ago, gringohombre said:

Let's just get to the real question...would you prefer to live in a Socialist or a Democratic country? I think you know MY answer...and please do not try to conflate the two, because that is how the EVIL   

This is a personal decision for me--I don't like socialism because I don't react well when some dumbass tries to run my life--I Guess that is just a character flaw of being an American---HA

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I'd prefer to live in a country that gave a damn about ALL their citizens and provided a decent living wage with health care for all. The terms Socialist and Communist no longer exist no matter how many times you say they do. This is the twenty first century and smart countries know that happy citizens are productive citizens... productive citizens who pay taxes. If you wish to stay stuck in the past with definitions from the past, that is your problem. 

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2 minutes ago, bobby brown said:

This is a personal decision for me--I don't like socialism because I don't react well when some dumbass tries to run my life--I Guess that is just a character flaw of being an American---HA

And another thing; I don't appreciate swartsnigger telling me to screw my freedom--" a son of a NAZI war criminal" ?--Them are fighting words for some "dumbass" American like myself---HA

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2 minutes ago, Ferret said:

I'd prefer to live in a country that gave a damn about ALL their citizens and provided a decent living wage with health care for all. The terms Socialist and Communist no longer exist no matter how many times you say they do. This is the twenty first century and smart countries know that happy citizens are productive citizens... productive citizens who pay taxes. If you wish to stay stuck in the past with definitions from the past, that is your problem. 

I can't help to stay in the past--I guess it's in my breeding--the way I feel; feels like it's in my DNA--No one get's over on me--Especially some :() politician . as bred German, Irish, Danish, English, Scot, and Dutch, and who knows what else:? and maybe some Neanderthal--HA--So now you know why I'm so screwed up----HA--Nobody tells me what to do !!--And "No" !!--I ain't taken no stincken  " JAB" ----HA

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15 hours ago, Ferret said:

I'd prefer to live in a country that gave a damn about ALL their citizens and provided a decent living wage with health care for all. The terms Socialist and Communist no longer exist no matter how many times you say they do. This is the twenty first century and smart countries know that happy citizens are productive citizens... productive citizens who pay taxes. If you wish to stay stuck in the past with definitions from the past, that is your problem. 

Of course...who would not love to have ALL citizens of ALL countries given a "decent living wage with health care for all."...The $64,000 question is WHO IS GOING TO PAY FOR IT???. If you believe Utopía is just around the corner, I have a bridge in Brooklyn to sell you!!! And as far as "The terms Socialist and Communist no longer exist no matter how many times you say they do."...what world are you living in???

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