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16 minutes ago, Natasha said:

OR.... don't buy in a fracc!  You came to Mexico ....so try and live IN Mexico..... lots to gain by not hiding behind those walls and gates.  Just sayin'...

Millions of people live in many countries in subdivisions. To say living in a Fracc. (subdivision) is not living in Mexico is ridiculous. And the majority of houses not in a fracc in the Chapala area have a wall and a gate. 

Every one of my family lives in a fracc. (subdivision} with the exception of one nephew who lives in a tower in GDL which is a condominium. We were all born in Mexico. Are you saying we are not living in Mexico?  

 

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I sure don't know about the U.S. but, in Canada, a subdivision is a totally different definition. It is not a fracc and it is not a condo. It is freehold and there are no dues to pay to an association for anything.

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15 minutes ago, Ferret said:

I sure don't know about the U.S. but, in Canada, a subdivision is a totally different definition. It is not a fracc and it is not a condo. It is freehold and there are no dues to pay to an association for anything.

So there are no subdivisions in Canada that were developed by a builder and that have some common benefit that residents must pay for?

Many of Calgary’s newer communities have Home Owners Association Fees or what's more commonly known as HOA fees. When you purchase a property in communities, like Auburn Bay, Mahogany, Legacy, Springbank Hill or West Springs, you pay an annual fee to the community association which goes towards the maintenance of community amenities such as lakes, spray parks, tennis courts and outdoor skating rinks, to name a few.

 It is common in many areas in the world. 

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2 minutes ago, Ferret said:

I sure don't know about the U.S. but, in Canada, a subdivision is a totally different definition. It is not a fracc and it is not a condo. It is freehold and there are no dues to pay to an association for anything.

Right on Ferret. ML is being a little  misleading by calling them the same, although in some ways they are similar. I do, however, get your point too ML. But your family is different.... they know what's what here, they make  decisions and know the rules and risk/benefits ahead of time.

My comment was directed at people who come to Lakeside with the express  intention to get behind (usually) guarded gates and walls so they can live among other foreigners and keep away from having/learning the Mexican way of life. These are the among the ones who mostly get their knickers in a twist as soon as they realize, not having bothered to read the fracc. rules when buying, that there's a price to pay for all that sociability and convenience".

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5 minutes ago, Mostlylost said:

That may be true in Canada. It is not true in many countries. 

IF you were correct, ML, then areas like Los Redes, Seis Esquinas, and other parts of towns lakeside that are like named subdivisions in a northern city would all be bound by fracc. rules, fees, and dues.   HAVING rules, fees, dues, board of directors, and commonality is part of what makes fraccs. a fracc.

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4 minutes ago, Natasha said:

IF you were correct, ML, then areas like Los Redes, Seis Esquinas, and other parts of towns lakeside that are like named subdivisions in a northern city would all be bound by fracc. rules, fees, and dues.   HAVING rules, fees, dues, board of directors, and commonality is part of what makes fraccs. a fracc.

The places you are naming are not fraccs nor subdivisions. They are simply part of a town that has a neighborhood name affiliated with it.. Very different than a piece of land that was purchased, urbanized, and developed by a company or individual.  

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Too funny! There are MANY pieces of land that were purchased, urbanized and developed by companies or individuals in Canada. They are NOT fraccs OR condominiums. SOME are but the majority are not. Your generalizations are far too sweeping. Personally, I abhor "associations" whether fraccs or condos. They are only as good as the people running them and the people supporting them. Those two things are about as variable as the weather and just as volatile. Each to his/her own.

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9 minutes ago, Ferret said:

Too funny! There are MANY pieces of land that were purchased, urbanized and developed by companies or individuals in Canada. They are NOT fraccs OR condominiums. SOME are but the majority are not. Your generalizations are far too sweeping. Personally, I abhor "associations" whether fraccs or condos. They are only as good as the people running them and the people supporting them. Those two things are about as variable as the weather and just as volatile. Each to his/her own.

Your generalization was the one far to sweeping. 

I only commented on your post because you said in Canada a subdivision is freehold and there are no dues to pay to an association for anything. Yet I was able to quote subdivisions that do have fees. 

There are fraccs in Mexico without associations just as they exist all over the world. Worldwide many developers put in fewer amenities and then when done hand it over to the local taxing authority to maintain. Here it an example is Riberas de Pilar. (I know the family that developed Riberas) 

My other comments were regarding Natasha's point of view saying you are not living in Mexico if you live in a fracc. And I asked if Mexicans in fraccs are not living in Mexico.

Natasha also commented about people living behind gates and walls couldn't experience Mexico. Odd because the majority of houses not in a fracc lakeside are behind a wall and a gate. 

 

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Are we agreed that Fraccionmiento and Subdivision are the same word? Are we agreed that there are private fraccionmiento's (gated) and public ones (not gated)? Are we agreed that Condominiums tend to be the vertical version of a private gated fracc?

Have dealt with condo's in Collingwood, Ontario and it's not something that I ever want to be involved with again. Have lived (rented) in two gated fraccs lakeside. Nope, not ever something I would buy into since it was amusing enough just watching what went on from the sidelines. IF I was a snowbird or someone that travelled a lot, I MAY reconsider the security aspects. YMMV.

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31 minutes ago, Ferret said:

Are we agreed that Fraccionmiento and Subdivision are the same word? Are we agreed that there are private fraccionmiento's (gated) and public ones (not gated)? Are we agreed that Condominiums tend to be the vertical version of a private gated fracc?

Have dealt with condo's in Collingwood, Ontario and it's not something that I ever want to be involved with again. Have lived (rented) in two gated fraccs lakeside. Nope, not ever something I would buy into since it was amusing enough just watching what went on from the sidelines. IF I was a snowbird or someone that travelled a lot, I MAY reconsider the security aspects. YMMV.

All but your description of a condominium in Mexico. In Mexico the definition of a condominium would include a closed private community. 

  The vast majority the Mexican condominiums are not vertical.  Example lakeside could be Riviera Alta or Vista Alegre which are regulated by condominium law and not corporate law like a fracc association. 

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I'll have to take your word for that. Riviera Alta is where we rented when we first moved back inland from the coast. La Huerta is the other one. Both developments are gated but the difference in monthly fees was unbelievable.

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3 hours ago, Ferret said:

I sure don't know about the U.S. but, in Canada, a subdivision is a totally different definition. It is not a fracc and it is not a condo. It is freehold and there are no dues to pay to an association for anything.

Why are we going down that  rabbit hole, the subject  matter is Mexico

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You have to go down the rabbit hole to show people that things are not the same in Mexico and that it's important to educate yourself before buying. People who live in other countries where building permits, zoning laws and amenities are nailed down with definitions and laws had better be aware of possible problems before buying. Eyes wide open so to speak.

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13 minutes ago, Ferret said:

You have to go down the rabbit hole to show people that things are not the same in Mexico and that it's important to educate yourself before buying. People who live in other countries where building permits, zoning laws and amenities are nailed down with definitions and laws had better be aware of possible problems before buying. Eyes wide open so to speak.

Indeed,especially if you lack even a bit of self sufficiency[knowledge]. This is not a nanny state-eh!

pedro kertesz

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Just reading this thread makes me extremely grateful we steered clear of fraccs  when we moved here and bought.  :D 

We do own a condo in GDL for our students and the condo law was reformed a couple years back and it has made a big difference in being able to collect from deadbeats and keep the property up. 

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8 hours ago, Natasha said:

Right on Ferret. ML is being a little  misleading by calling them the same, although in some ways they are similar. I do, however, get your point too ML. But your family is different.... they know what's what here, they make  decisions and know the rules and risk/benefits ahead of time.

My comment was directed at people who come to Lakeside with the express  intention to get behind (usually) guarded gates and walls so they can live among other foreigners and keep away from having/learning the Mexican way of life. These are the among the ones who mostly get their knickers in a twist as soon as they realize, not having bothered to read the fracc. rules when buying, that there's a price to pay for all that sociability and convenience".

There are fraccionamientos  all over GDL Metro area that doesn´t have even one "get behind guarded gates and walls foreigner" living there.  I can´t imagine what you are thinking.  You think mexicanos don´t do this?  LOLOL

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I think I understand where Natasha is coming from. I wonder about the same kinds of people who think that staying in an all inclusive resort in ANY country is actually representative of that country. Just not my cup of tea but everyone's different.

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11 hours ago, Natasha said:

OR.... don't buy in a fracc!  You came to Mexico ....so try and live IN Mexico..... lots to gain by not hiding behind those walls and gates.  Just sayin'...

A survey of the eight Fraccionamientos at their meeting on Tuesday revealed approximately half their owners are Mexican. I wonder why they're hiding behind the walls and gates?

SunFan

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20 minutes ago, Ferret said:

Only residence? Or weekend/vacation residence?

I have no statistics that detailed.

My point is its not only foreigners who find fraccionamientos an attractive place to live.

SunFan

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Fraccionamiento- Is usually a Development where the streets and services are owned by the Municipality. ( Sometimes wells are owned by the HOA)  There can be an HOA or not. There are some examples mentioned here. ( The law refers to all developments  where new streets are  built as Fraccionamientos.)  If there is no HOA in most cases the government must manage services.

Subdivision - The dividing of land into two or more pieces.

Condominio- Is a 100% private development. Streets and most services are owned by Condominos. The rules can be enforced easier and with more force than an HOA. You own  a percentage of the development with the exclusive use of your "Unidad Privativa". Condos have the advantage of being able to deny entry and better enforcement but sometimes higher costs.

 

Both Fraccs and Condos have their positive and negative points. Order, security and services are usually better. Not for everyone, but as written by others decide what you want first if you don't want to pay dues and obey rules don't buy in one. If you appreciate the benefits they provide buy.

You can love Mexico from a house in a Fracc. or the village. 

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