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Mexico's vaccination rollout has been pathetic. Congratulations to all who have enough money to take advantage of the offering.

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We hope to visit family in the states in June and get the vaccination while we're there.

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It is a failure of the free market system in Mexico. The first requirement was that the government body in charge of such things preapprove all types of vaccines for the public. The second was that all the people who could not afford to pay get vaccinated. The third was only then they would release vaccines for private sale. Rather than see a tidy profit, subsidizing the poor, the government decided to close up those doors completely. In the U.S. you can already see private vaccinations offered by drug stores and medical clinics. Not free, of course, but still affordable and immediate. We will not reach that stage until October is my guess.

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The vaccinations in the US are no cost. To say Mexico has a free market system is a stretch. 

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35 minutes ago, CHILLIN said:

SNIP...............In the U.S. you can already see private vaccinations offered by drug stores and medical clinics. Not free, of course, but still affordable and immediate. We will not reach that stage until October is my guess.

Thee doesn't know of what thee speaks.... NO Covid vaccine in the US has an end-party cost! 

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You are right, but it is certainly starting to lean that way very quickly. Look at Walgreens rollout, Biden's latest request for private sector help, and in the UK, private sector just a couple weeks away. The government will say, fine, if people dont want these vaccines, we will not let them pile up, we will just sell all these doses or give them away to needy countries.

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They aren't going to send them to other countries because of liability issues. The drug companies are protected in the US but not outside. 

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This is from the Grumpy Economist:

Vaccines and liability

Posted: 26 Apr 2021 03:52 PM PDT

I learned something from the New York Times lead editorial on Sunday. Why are we not shipping mega quantities of vaccines to countries like India? 

... as the vaccines came to market, some vaccine makers insisted on sweeping liability protections that further imperiled access for poorer countries. The United States, for example, is prohibited from selling or donating its unused doses, as Vanity Fair has reported, because the strong liability protections that drugmakers enjoy here don’t extend to other countries...

Pfizer has reportedly not only sought liability protection against all civil claims — even those that could result from the company’s own negligence — but has asked governments to put up sovereign assets, including their bank reserves, embassy buildings and military bases, as collateral against lawsuits. 

Well, you can sort of see the problem. You're a drug company. You sell a billion units of a brand new drug -- still on emergency use authorization in the US -- to, say, India. 10 people get a rare blood clot that may or may not be due to your vaccine. Local courts sue you for a gazillion dollars. Who wouldn't want liability protection? 

As the Europeans allowed trillions of GDP and quite a few lives to vanish while they haggled over a few billion in cost of vaccines, perhaps the onus on countries should be, to say, we want your vaccine, we understand it's brand new and there may be risks, we'll take them?  

The NYT is, predictably, full of bad ideas. 

 

Suspend patents. Nearly 60 nations have petitioned the World Trade Organization to allow countries to temporarily override intellectual property rights for coronavirus-related drugs and vaccines, but so far the measure is languishing. The Biden administration should support this waiver, nudge vaccine makers into voluntary licensing agreements and help build the public-private partnerships needed to bring those agreements to fruition. It should also press companies to offer better deals to the countries trying to secure doses — no more absurd indemnity clauses that protect company profits over human lives.

"Suspend patents." Great. Just in time to discourage drug companies from working full steam to identify the new variants stewing around the world and get moving on updated vaccines. Once again, all you need to know about cost benefit analysis is that trillions > billions. The profits' of drug companies are drops in the bucket. Related to a twitter stream going on, it's always time for that "once and never more" property expropriation isn't it? 

But most of all,   "absurd indemnity clauses that protect company profits over human lives?" If you mean it, dear Times, here's a suggestion: You offer to pay for any legal damages that foreign courts assess to US drugmakers over vaccines gone wrong. Not that hot to put "people" over your own "profits," eh?

The administration should also lift any embargoes resulting from its use of the Defense Production Act. President Biden was wise to use this law to bolster domestic vaccine production, but that move has also prevented companies from exporting raw materials. As a result, production lines in India and elsewhere are at risk of shutting down for want of key ingredients available in the United States. 

I'll given them the first, but not the "wise." DPA was silly in the first place. We're not building aircraft carriers for WWII, and it is beyond hypocritical to complain about Chinese and others banning exports to us while we do that. Instead our newly internationalist administration should work to stop all export bans worldwide in such situations. The world needs to work together, and that means to use our global supply chains when we need speed and efficiency. 

http://feeds.feedburner.com/~r/TheGrumpyEconomist/~4/GJswSiZRdU4?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=email
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3 hours ago, CHILLIN said:

You are right, but it is certainly starting to lean that way very quickly. Look at Walgreens rollout, Biden's latest request for private sector help, and in the UK, private sector just a couple weeks away. The government will say, fine, if people dont want these vaccines, we will not let them pile up, we will just sell all these doses or give them away to needy countries.

So wrong the first time and now you're speculating. Unless, of course, you have a relative or friend in high places in the US of A.... which I highly doubt!

 

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5 hours ago, CHILLIN said:

It is a failure of the free market system in Mexico. The first requirement was that the government body in charge of such things preapprove all types of vaccines for the public. The second was that all the people who could not afford to pay get vaccinated. The third was only then they would release vaccines for private sale. Rather than see a tidy profit, subsidizing the poor, the government decided to close up those doors completely. In the U.S. you can already see private vaccinations offered by drug stores and medical clinics. Not free, of course, but still affordable and immediate. We will not reach that stage until October is my guess.

In the USA it is illegal at this time to charge for a COVID vaccination. The drug stores, Walmart, and clinics all give the vaccination without cost. They will bill your insurance if you have it, but if you have no insurance the vac is free. 

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12 hours ago, CHILLIN said:

Its human nature and capitalism. The Girl Scouts of America has been left with a 3 million surplus cookies. Think they are going to throw them away?

The Girl Scouts raise money by selling their cookies.  Why would anyone think they would throw them away????

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18 hours ago, tomgates said:

They aren't going to send them to other countries because of liability issues. The drug companies are protected in the US but not outside. 

Disagree, completely.   Pfizer and Moderna would have already been shipping from US to both Mexico and Canada, but the US gov't blocked the exports to build a massive inventory, way more than the US needs or can even use, in either the short or long term.     So the vaccines have had to come from Europe and other places when they could have come by a 2 hour drive from Kalamazoo Michingan.      So that's "fine", but then don't whine when the borders stay closed since the people in those countries are not protected yet.     Sharing = being good neighbours and is good for business too.

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19 hours ago, CHILLIN said:

You are right, but it is certainly starting to lean that way very quickly. Look at Walgreens rollout, Biden's latest request for private sector help, and in the UK, private sector just a couple weeks away. The government will say, fine, if people dont want these vaccines, we will not let them pile up, we will just sell all these doses or give them away to needy countries.

What a long, round-about way of saying, “I was wrong.” 🤣

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6 hours ago, Bisbee Gal said:

The Girl Scouts raise money by selling their cookies.  Why would anyone think they would throw them away????

You are right. They will try to unload them at dollar stores and the like. If 25% of the population says they do not want the vaccine, and stocks start to pile up, the thinking will be the same - at least three people have posted here that they received their shots from commercial sources. The vaccine is free, but probably a charge for the syringe or I dont know what. The U.S.A. is a very foreign place to me. I have only been there maybe twice in the past thirty years. The last time was trying to drive through to Mexico as quickly as possible.

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15 minutes ago, CHILLIN said:

You are right. They will try to unload them at dollar stores and the like. If 25% of the population says they do not want the vaccine, and stocks start to pile up, the thinking will be the same - at least three people have posted here that they received their shots from commercial sources. The vaccine is free, but probably a charge for the syringe or I dont know what. The U.S.A. is a very foreign place to me. I have only been there maybe twice in the past thirty years. The last time was trying to drive through to Mexico as quickly as possible.

You don't know squat. 

Vax in US is FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE

Stop making crap up.  

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1 hour ago, Bisbee Gal said:

You don't know squat. 

Vax in US is FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE

Stop making crap up.  

DITO DITO DITO  

 

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Flew into Orlando on Friday .... went to a FEMA walk up site on Sunday a.m. Choice of Johnson and Johnson or Pfizer vaccine . We took the Johnson and Johnson in and out in less than an hour including the health check. No side effects or soreness of the arm the next day....went kayaking. The FEMA site was amazing..... dozens of national guard assisting patients between tents no lines with at least 20 vaccination seats in each tent, and of course… No charge .

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44 minutes ago, daisy2013 said:

Free here also

The only country that contemplated directly charging its residents was Egypt.  Equivalent of $12, which is estimated to be more than the WEEKLY salary of 1/3 of Egyptians. 

The country backed off after a lot of well-deserved bad publicity; now says if someone says they can't afford it the vaccine will be free for them.  

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