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A professional woman we know in Guadalajara just checked in with us to see how we were doing.  She said that there is civil unrest in the city and a person has been killed (shot by police).  Does anyone have any verified information about this?

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Its marches against the Mexican version of George Floyd where a young man was beaten and murdered by police in Ixtlahuacan de Membrillos for not wearing a face mask. There are organized protests over several days about it (s best to avoid GDL right now), at least one that did become violent. I am not sure this will get the same coverage internationally as the George Floyd case has been getting. Maybe someone else can fill in the details but there is a US consulate advisory about it.

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14 hours ago, Semalu said:

Its marches against the Mexican version of George Floyd

Not really. It's definitely about police brutality, but it's not about systemic racism, which is what the US protests are about. The young man beaten and murdered by the police was Mexican, as were the cops who did it.

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All very sad and frightening.  Thinking of the families who have lost loved ones.  :(

Val

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This may not be a racial issue but it certainly appears to be a police brutality issue.  Not wearing a face mask should not be a capital offense.

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On 6/6/2020 at 2:18 PM, mudgirl said:

Not really. It's definitely about police brutality, but it's not about systemic racism, which is what the US protests are about. The young man beaten and murdered by the police was Mexican, as were the cops who did it.

In this country, all citizens are Mexican. Not true NOB, as there are black, white, yellow, red, brown,etc. That is causing their problem and that does not exist in most countries.

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5 minutes ago, The Cardinal said:

In this country, all citizens are Mexican. Not true NOB, as there are black, white, yellow, red, brown,etc. That is causing their problem and that does not exist in most countries.

Mexico has a growing number of citizens who are of mixed race and some who are non Hispanic.  The world is changing all the time.

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11 hours ago, The Cardinal said:

In this country, all citizens are Mexican. Not true NOB, as there are black, white, yellow, red, brown,etc. That is causing their problem and that does not exist in most countries.

you make no sense.. Blacks are US citizens just as people from other races in the US .What are you trying to say.?

Racism is alive and well in most countries and police brutality also happens in many countries  .. The US seems particularly bad but it can happen anywhere.. Do you think that Blacks an North Africans are treated the same as the other local in Europe?

Here  I know people who were brutally beaten by cops, one of the man lost the vision in one eye an had broken ribs for smoking dope at the malecaon an playing music.

Who know what the cops were after when they arrested Giovanni Lopez n Ixtlahuacan.. It is very difficult to ever know the truth here but the man was taken alive from his family an was dead the next day  We probably will never hear the whole story but that is another nasty exemple of police abuse.

By the way there were troubles in Ixtlahuacan thursday night as well . my godson was on a second class bus coming back from Guadalhara late that day an could not make it tio Chapala , He spent the nigt withp people in Ixtlahuacan as he was too afraid of walking the streets there that night. He also spent a couple of hours stuck on the bus..

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2 hours ago, The Cardinal said:

In this country, all citizens are Mexican. Not true NOB, as there are black, white, yellow, red, brown,etc. That is causing their problem and that does not exist in most countries.

You are confusing race with nationality. Of course all Mexican citizens are Mexican. Just like all American citizens are American, all Canadian citizens are Canadian. That's what it means to be a citizen, duh. There are Mexican citizens who are white, who are of Chinese heritage, , who are of Arabic heritage, etc. You should get out more.

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2 hours ago, The Cardinal said:

In this country, all citizens are Mexican. Not true NOB, as there are black, white, yellow, red, brown,etc. That is causing their problem and that does not exist in most countries.

In Mexico there are light citizens, there are medium colored citizens and then there are the really discriminated-against dark Mexicans.  Discrimination is alive and well in Mexico.  Just as in EVERY other country of the world.  And it doesn't have to be about race or nationality.  It can be about almost anything that makes a smaller group different than a larger group.

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21 hours ago, El Menudo said:

Mexico has a growing number of citizens who are of mixed race and some who are non Hispanic.  The world is changing all the time.

Mexico has been mixed race since the beginning of of the Conquest. Hernan Cortez had a child by his indigenous translator/mistress La Malinche. The child may have been the first mestizo (mixed race person), or at least one of the first. Shortly after the Conquest, the Spanish began importing large numbers of African slaves to work in the sugar haciendas. People from the Far East began appearing very early too, brought over by the Manila Galleons. Spanish men had children by women of all these various races and the different groups also intermarried. People with a purely Spanish or European background have always been a minority in Mexico. The vast majority of Mexicans are mestizo.

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I took the Cardinal's comment to suggest that Mexicans of most if not all races view themselves as Mexicans rather than hyphenated Mexicans.  Perhaps he'd like to clarify.

I wonder, though, if that is really true in places like Chiapas and other more remote parts of the country heavily populated by the indigenas.  BMH?

 

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15 minutes ago, Mainecoons said:

I took the Cardinal's comment to suggest that Mexicans of most if not all races view themselves as Mexicans rather than hyphenated Mexicans.  Perhaps he'd like to clarify.

I wonder, though, if that is really true in places like Chiapas and other more remote parts of the country heavily populated by the indigenas.  BMH?

 

Exactly. No hyphenated  citizens here. That is a major problem NOB. Are you a rocket scientist? 

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2 minutes ago, The Cardinal said:

Exactly. No hyphenated  citizens here. That is a major problem NOB. Are you a rocket scientist? 

LOL.  No.  Environmental engineer. 

 

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I can only speak for the indigenous I can speak Spanish with and yes they all feel very much Mexicans an are proud of being Mexicans..  Mexicans however may mean something slightly different to them as they are the original Mexicans.. I have rarely heard of a non educated tzotzil or tzeltal refer to themselves as Maya but they all proud Mexicans.  The people who do not speak Spanish, I have no idea.. Indigenous are enrolled very early by their leaders to vote and they all have an ID card /voting card and they all vote as a block so they are very much courted by the politicians.

I also have many ffriends who are Zapatista and there , I do not know what they response woul be as they view themselves as autonomous.. I have never discussed that point with them.. We do talk about some of their ideas and philosophy but as a rule it is more focused on some very specific ideas or subject rather than their feelings about being Mexicans.. I have a feeling that they would respond that they are the real Mexicans  but who knows.. I ll have to ask them.

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Whilst hiking the mountains this last couple of weeks we have been confronted on  several occasions by groups  of local ejidos , who tell us where  we can and can’t hike along with other instructions...doesn’t  really bother me ...we just use other trails but it does surprise me to see them denying Mexicans access.. ( .we’re not talking the ceremonial grounds  ) ..Probably one of the reasons the hiking groups were disbanded .I thought the mountains like the beaches were open to all Mexicans....sign of the times...maybe..?

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the people owning the ejido look at the ejido land as their private land...and they have the right to do so. What is intersting about the whole controversy up hull is that communal land and ejial land was granted so indigenous and campesinos ha access to lan to build their houses and to have milpas. In a lot of indigenous areas people have to use the land if they want to keep it, if they do not they lose it. They are also the ones taking care of the land and going there when there are fires, when they need to take care of the land.. Here this part has been forgotten ...they only want the land to control it which is not the original deal. 

Ejidal land is land that was taken away from haciendas and distributedd to communities

Communal lan is land that was granted by the Spaniards t indigenous..  I can see that in Mezcala the Coca people have those types of rules and are the true owners.. 

Above Ajijic it is a joke,, the indigenous here are not really indigenous any longer, they do not live according to ejidal or communal land but they want the benefits an want to deny access to people  who have been there  just about as long as they have. It is  pretty controversial and they do not want anyone snooping around as they want to sell the place and do not want any photos of anyone beginning to clear when they want to clear the place...

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