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15 hours ago, slainte39 said:

The government would do it indiscriminately, whereas the individuals would pick favorites causing more friction.

Like you know during the Irish potato famine...….soup for the protestants no soup for the Catholics unless you were ready to convert.

Have to disagree there...I think governments pick winners and losers quite regularly and it helps being a winner if you are a strong supporter of said government as you correctly pointed out above. And you know there was no potato famine, it was created by the Brits. There was plenty of food in Ireland total but the Brits exported much for themselves, leaving the people who lived where the potato crop failed not much choice.

I will, of course, carefully consider any new info you may add. I never change my mind but I have been known to make a new decision based on new information. LOL

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Nahhhh...…….we are in total agreement   (that´s good)……….to disagree.  Leave at that for now.

The landed gentry, ,mainly the Anglo.Irish, owned the land and controlled the food production, shipping to England for cash.  The tenant farmers were given small plots to grow potatoes and that was it.   Listen again to "The Fields of Athenry", a famine era topic.....Michael is being sent to the Australian Penal Colony for stealing Trevelyan´s corn. Anybody with an oz. of Irish blood knows how worthless Trevelyan and his corn was.     :(

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On 11/29/2019 at 7:27 PM, bmh said:

depends on the cook.My cleaning lady cooks for the same amount as she cleans.

Mine too in Chapala.

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On 11/30/2019 at 1:21 PM, mexjerry said:

Here we go AGAIN!!

TO FSCKING CHEAP $500 mxn pesos=$25.56US dollars

$60 mxn pesos= 3.06 mxn pesos

For some fscking sake, pay the people a DESCENT WAGE

Yes, it is always good to be generous, especially when it is easy for the giver.   However, everything is relative.  Mexican minimum wage is about 6 pesos per hour vs. US minimum wage = about 150 pesos ($7.25) per hour.   60 pesos per hour is 10 times the minimum wage, the equivalent of  $70 per hour in the US.  That is an excellent living wage in Mexico, even if someone is working part-time and even here where expats have driven up prices for everything over the last 30 years and living expenses are higher than in most of Mexico.  60 pesos per hour is among the highest rates paid by expats for domestic work.  60 pesos per hour, quite above a decent wage, is an excellent wage.

 

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How much do Mex jerry pay his cleaning lady if he has one? .. 60 pesos  nothing reported to SAT with vacations, alguinado  and IMSS is a good salary.. I know many people in Chiapas who would work for a whole less than that....My cleaning lady has been working for me for 19 years and has no problem with what I pay her.

Do not understand what the 60 pesos = 3.06 pesos mean.. is that supposed to be dolars??  Who cares about the dollars , I am French and live in Mexico not in Mexico.. I do not translate everything in Euros so why are you translating in US dollars.

The gardener is a friend, who works for Tapatios here. He makes 70 pesos an hour and can work jon anything, , he does the pool. he is an albañil, helps me with my husband, name it   , he does it and hs wife brings us food when we are sick.. He gets 70 pesos an hor and that is what he wants not what I am offering.. I think that mexjerry has no clue ..

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On 11/30/2019 at 1:55 PM, barcelonaman said:

Too many expats just wont listen, and compare things back to their home country. This is mexico.

Theres a recent thread about cost of living has shot up here recently, its stuff like this thats part of the problem,especially ajijic

Totally excessive tipping, saying how cheap services are, etc etc. All just ruins it for the locals and long term expats.

Unfortunately this area is a bubble to most, and never see the real parts of mexico and will blindly go along living in la la land. 

 

 

I totally agree.  Some people just compare what is cheap to them or "back home".  It's a ridiculous comparison.  The affordability is why many of us are here to begin with.  If we make all the prices shoot up, it makes it harder to afford.

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Exactly. But the point that seems to be the headliner here is how much money expats have, and therefore it does not hurt them to shower their workers with extra money. Paying them inflated wages just because you can, is not the way to help, as explained so well by others in this thread.

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So a few foreigners are going to spend enough money to put Mexico into the top tier of wage earner salaries?  What a laugh, they are one grain of sand on a big beach.

You see Pappy that´s why I would rather have the government collect and disburse money rather than individuals. Oh, I  know the argument you´ll put up about corruption…..but….. You can correct dishonesty but not stupidity.

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No one said anything about top tier, or all of Mexico, either. But you've seen the results yourself here. We live in a financial bubble, and it has gotten deleterious over the years I've been here. Blue collar workers expecting and extracting ridiculous sums for tiny bits of work. Go to any small town away from here and you won't find that.

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I'll bet slainte, being Mexican, can easily hire all the workers he wants at normal rates. It's just the immigrants who have to pay inflated prices because they haven't learned the language and hang with mostly other immigrants. You probably won't find a "good deal" at the LCS and I bet locals like slainte don't go there looking for good deals. Same is true NOB when immigrants don't learn the language and hang with fellow immigrants they end up working for the lowest wages and in reverse ruin it for the other workers. Nothing new here.

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Anybody here can get good local workers at non gringo inflated prices.

Fair pay ,for a fair job.

How many gingos pay way over the top then complain ,they dont turn up, bad work etc etc, the vast majority.

They say the price is too cheap and pay 50 percent or more.this is the problem. And dont get me started on tipping locally!!

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Who says it's gringo-inflated? That to me is just a typical assumption.

Just yesterday, I was setting up some software for a very interesting Mexican lady, a grandmother, and she asked for a service guy recommendation for some work. I only know one that fit the bill, and I told her just to be aware that his prices can be silly. He's Mexican, too. She was aghast at his prices and said she was a Mexican, dammit. He said, that's the price, lady.

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2 minutes ago, pappysmarket said:

OK, good example...but why would a Mexican be asking an immigrant for a recommendation in the first place?  

Because she knows him and trust him, maybe. Breaking people into immigrants and Mexicans does not work.. Some people know more than some others on  a specific subject and people ask recommendations from each other .. Nothing to do with nationalities..

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On 11/30/2019 at 4:14 PM, barcelonaman said:

I have lived in numerous countries in my time and never encountered this ridiculous problem anywhere.

There were no American expats in these places.

I also have lived in numerous countries, some that I could not have afforded without a corporate package that covered the rent, car, and a cost of living adjustment. I adjusted to the local norms. In some countries there was no tipping—it was considered an insult. In others there was a yearly ‘tip’ in the form of a significant financial gift. In others, the wedding guest needed to contact the venue to ensure that the wedding gift, always money, covered at least the cost of your part of the party. 

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True...but...if you work within the "gringo economy" primarily you don't have the depth of knowledge the locals have. So if you ask Mike for a recommendation you should not be surprised the price will be higher than if you asked a local. If you don't know a local to ask, that's fine but to expect Mike to know someone less expensive? Not realistic in my opinion. Nationalities is not the key I'm talking about. It's language and a network that only is inclusive of immigrants to a small degree. In my experience as an innkeeper, most everyone says they're going to learn Spanish and become part of their local community. Maybe 5% actually do learn Spanish and the vast majority have a social life that revolves around LCS and the other various gringo orgs that abound. If you have to ask for a recommendation for almost anything on this board you will be steered to the gringo economy. That's fine but don't expect "local pricing" here or from your friends at LCS, etc. In general they know we have more money and they will try to get it. Pretty normal behavior in my opinion and it's up to each of us to break out or accept reality. Whine about your neighbor paying too much for help but I bet most can't assist in finding someone charging more local prices.

Edit: I'm responding to bmh not ajijiccharlie

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I agree, that language is the key, but it is not the only consideration.

When we first bought a home in Ajijic, we soon discovered that local prices were as much as 40% higher than we could find in Guadalajara, Tonala, or Tlaquepaque; places most would think might be more expensive. At that time, we had no Spanish & had to rely on marked prices for hardware, appliances, etc., but I always dickered for larger purchaces of multiple appliances.  Later, after selling that home and buying in Chapala, I had some Spanish and more experience. What a difference!  Even poor Spanish will gain you a certain amount of respect for trying, and making progress. People suddenly become more helpful, and much more friendly. I admire their patience!

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For the particular service this woman asked, there are only two that I know of. One is a gringo, and one is a Mexican. It had nothing to do with "the gringo community" (the gringo is far more expensive than the Mexican).

I have, for example, a stove/fridge/washer repairman, Mexican, lives just near me, and does superior work. I "found" him after going through a dozen half-assed jobbers. He does not "discriminate", if you will, between expats and locals, in terms of price OR quality of work. The suggestion that I don't know any better because I am a gringo is frankly off-putting.

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No insult or disrespect was meant. Thicken that skin just a bit. You undoubtedly have more experience in the local economy than most expats. You probably don't come on this board for help in hiring a worker, as many members do. Conversely probably not many locals contact you for construction help recommendations but I bet many of your computer clients hope you can find them all kinds of workers at local prices. I wouldn't expect you to have that expertise. Perhaps you do and if so you might want to branch out a bit. 

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We've always gotten along pretty well. But your comment "thicken that skin just a bit" is just as patronizing. Why would you assume my recommendations are going to be higher? that's just a completely wrong assumption. You are categorizing me as a know-nothing expat.

I do come on this board, frequently, looking for workers. Whether or not other people ask me for construction help recommendations has nothing to do with this. You ran a B&B; you know how everyone suddenly sees you as their best friend and source for all info on living here. I get it all the time. After 20 years, I've been through a few workers. (I still won't recommend anyone very often, because "no good deed goes unpunished".)

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