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Hey all.  I'm not in Chapala but im in the Quintana Roo area, thus still Mexico but in the much bigger tourist area.  But I assume the same answers applies as its in the same country.

 

 

Here, there are banks and atms like bancomer, banamex, santander, hsbc, cibanco.  I previously withdrew from banamex a while back with my US debit card... would do 10000 pesos and that seem to be the max.  Then i found out about hsbc where you could withdraw 15000 pesos.  So ever since then, i been doing that.  But back then hsbc only charged 33.50 pesos or so per withdraw.  Now its 63.50 pesos.  But not only that... i didn't find out till recently that with the hsbc atm machine, there is option to accept/decline the DCC conversion rate... that you could actually decline it.  I thought doing that meant the transaction won't go through.  So all those times i clicked on accept, it cost me much more money.  They advertise the rate at the hsbc machines where say google showed 1 usd - 19 pesos, it would show 18 pesos or so.  But when i clicked on decline, i notice when i looked at the amount of money deducted from my US bank account, it was a good amount less than if i accepted the conversion.  Now i have quite a bit of questions.

 

 

1.  Which of the banks atms offer option to accept/decline the DCC rate?  When i previously used Banamex, i don't recall if they have this option.  Do they or do they not? Also does it depend on your debit card?  Mine is a mastercard though.  But do visa debit cards also have this option as well if they used hsbc atm machines back then?  I heard recently, all Visa debit cards now have this option now.

 

 

2.   What is the atm withdraw limit for each bank and their fees?  I know 

 

hsbc = 15000 pesos  63.50 pesos

cibanco - 25000 peso? 17.40 pesos

santander -

banamex - 10000 pesos?

bancomer- 

 

Does anyone know what is withdraw atm limit and fee for each bank?  I heard cibanco can do up to 50 bills so it could do max of 25000 pesos if your usa bank allow you that limit.  Is that true you could do 25000 pesos at cibanco?  Where im located, only one cibanco atm.  Is that same for you guys in chapala?  I heard there was one in chapala area as well so i assume same?   But is it true cibanco can run out of bills fast so if you use it at night, you might could only withdraw say 5000 or 8000 pesos only?  I never had an issue withdrawing from hsbc and getting 15000 pesos each time.  So hsbc has highest withdraw atm fee and cibanco has lowest right?  The other 3 banks are in the middle?

 

 

3.  I tried to use the cibanco atm here earlier.  I put my card in... then typed in my pin number.  Type in 15000 pesos.  Then clicked on answer to like next 2 questions etc.  Then the screen showed a message which i assume was processing transaction.  This took like an entire minute or even longer it seemed.  Then it showed a message that was in english transaction timed out.  I then checked to where the money dispenses from and nothing came out and i tried to push the thing to see if it was like where you had to push the thing to take the money out but i could not.  Then i took my debit card out and left.  There was no money deducted from my us checking account.  Has anyone here had this issue with cibanco?  This was my first time using the ATM and i thought... why is this atm doing this?  With hsbc, its pretty quick.

 

 

 

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4.   Now this is the most confusing thing that I don't understand and have not gotten a clear answer.  People say cibanco has lowest atm withdraw fee.  But i believe... they don't give you the option to accept/decline the DCC rate right?  If that is the case, then what rate are they giving you?  Is it their bank rate?  Or is it your US bank rate?  Example on google if you type in 1 usd = 19 pesos.  But at cibanco, it shows 18.2 pesos or so.  So that means if you withdraw say 15000 pesos at cibanco and pay a 17.40 peso withdraw fee... you are also getting it at the 18.2 peso rate?  I saw that rate at the bank outside and also near the atm.  So that rate applies for that entire day at the bank?  But the atm... its constantly changing?  Example you go early in the morning with cibanco atm, rate could be 18.2... u go at night it could be 18.3?  Also is the rate they advertise at the bank the rate you get if you exchange USD for pesos like when it shows 18.2 usd?

 

5. Is hsbc and santander the only atms that allow you to accept/decline the DCC rate?

 

 

6.  If you want to withdraw larger amounts, which bank atm is the cheapest?  Say you want to withdraw 15000.  At hsbc, you pay 63.50p withdraw fee which i believe is highest of all banks right?  But if you do that and decline the DCC rate, wouldn't that mean less money is deducted from your US bank account compared to going to cibanco and withdrawing 15000 pesos and paying a cheaper 17.40p withdraw fee because they rate they give you is their own rate which is going to be much worst than your home US bank rate?  I notice when i withdrew from hsbc 15000 pesos, if i type 15063.50 pesos on google and convert that to us dollars... what gets deducted from my us checking account is very close.  Previously when i accepted the conversion... it was like 40 dollars more or so i paid extra.  Others can confirm this right?

 

 

7. So if im correct on this, the cheapest way to withdraw larger amounts of money has to be santander 1st and then hsbc 2nd? The reason is because these 2 banks allow you to decline the DCC rate?  And santander i believe the atm withdraw fee is like 27 pesos or less right? But the atm limit with satander is 9000 pesos? I heard this number somewhere but not sure if thats correct or not. Because if you withdraw 9000 pesos each time from santander, you pay 27 pesos, so you could get 18000 pesos total for 54 total withdraw fee and also getting it at your home US bank exchange rate right? Thus its even a bit better than hsbc where you get 15000 pesos for 63.50 withdraw fee and getting it at your home US bank exchange rate?  

 

After these 2 banks, the next cheapest has to be cibanco since it uses their own rate like the other banks such as banamex and bancomer but the only differenece is they have the cheapest withdraw fee?  So if you withdraw 5000 pesos right now from cibanco compared to say banamex or bancomer... each of these 3 banks are giving their own individual bank rates right?  And cibanco is the best rate of all?  I always heard cibanco has best exchange rate.  Then you add in cibanco has the lowest atm fee of all, they are the best atm to use for best exchange rate and withdraw fees if you don't include santander and hsbc?

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I use CI Banco as often as possible.  The exchange rate I'm given is decided by my bank.  And my US bank allows me to withdraw $1000US per day.  There is a sign above the ATM at CI that stipulates how much you can withdraw but this is only because they don't have enough money in the ATM machine to service everybody that wants to withdraw in a 24 hr. period so they ASK you to only take a max amount.  However, if I need $1000US in one withdrawal, I take it and the ATM doesn't stop me.

 

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The rate of exchange is decided by either Visa or Mastercard.

Your bank might have a foreign exchange fee of 1-3% depending on the bank.

HSBC has figured out they can make a profit by having you decide to accept their exchange rate instead of Visa or MC's rate. If you decline you will receive the cards rate no problem.

The daily withdrawal limit is set by your bank. Some ATM's will have their own limit that could be different than your bank. 

Choose a bank that reimburses ATM fees and it doesn't matter what the ATM charge is because your bank will credit it back.

https://usa.visa.com/support/consumer/travel-support/exchange-rate-calculator.html/

 

https://www.mastercard.us/content/mccom/en-us/consumers/get-support/convert-currency.html/

  

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Okay so only hsbc and santander ask you if you want to accept/decline the dcc rate then?  

 

So you are telling me if say banamex you withdraw 5000 pesos and say the atm fee is 30 pesos to make it simple, say another bank like intercam also charges 30 peso fee for atm... then the rate you are getting your pesos is the same regardless?

 

Thus you withdrawing 5000 pesos from cibanco with the 17.40 peso fee... or banamex with 30 peso fee or another atm with 35 peso fee... you are getting the same peso rate?   The only difference is you are paying a bit less for the atm fee?  Thus if you want to withdraw 15000 pesos from cibanco vs hsbc and decline the dcc in hsbc... you get your bank rate no matter what and pay a bit less for the cibanco atm withdraw fee of 17.40 compared to 63.5?   Can others confirm this?

 

I had thought banks like banamex, cibanco which do not have that accept/decline dcc option would basically give you their bank rate peso rate...

 

Then why do ppl say banks like cibanco give great rates compared to other banks.  Like they give 18.2 etc.  Does that number mean exchanging another currency for pesos in person at bank?

 

 

 

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Why not select a bank where it's convenient to park, go in the bank and withdraw the funds directly.  No fees.  That's the old fashioned way, isn't it?  😉

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Lots of factors are in play when using an ATM, whether in Mexico or another country. One needs to sit down and do the calculations to see what the best combination of options is.

Here is a link to a good explanation of DCC  rates (Dynamic Currency Conversion), which have been around for about 10 years in Europe but just hit our machines this year. It is always your right to decline the DCC rate which, in most cases, does not favor the person on the card. The button to decline is on the left bottom of the screen, directly across from the "accept" button but may not be labeled. (How's that for blatant lack of transparency?)

https://www.investopedia.com/dynamic-currency-conversion-dcc-term-4769305

In a foreign transaction, many partners want to cash in on your transaction: ATM fees, credit card foreign transaction fees, your card's currency transaction rate, the (un)helpful DCC fees... Add to this that some ATMS are more prone to corruption, are more frequently out of cash to dispense, or are in locations inconvenient for you and you have some intangible variables to add to your choice of an ATM.

1. Most debit cards offer at or near the Visa/MC trading rate. Some charge a foreign transaction fee; others do not; others yet refund all fees at the end of a monthly billing cycle. Ask your institution(s) their rates and compare.

2. Your ATM also charges a fee, which varies by institution and sometimes even by machine location for the service. That fee varies: right now, HSBC is about $64;; Multiva near $98; CI Banco around $17. If your institution refunds this transaction fee, it's a non-issue; if it does not, then factor this in. Remember, this is per transaction--3 transactions of $300 costs 3x one transaction of $900; if your limit doesn't allow the $900, though (see below), you'll get hit with this fee.

3. You legally have the right to decline the DCC rate, but that option/button often is not a clear choice. Whether all machines clearly mark this option, I cannot say. When I've used one that doesn't clearly indicate a "Decline" button, I push where that button is located (but not indicated by the screen popup) and the DCC rate--not the transaction (that would be "Cancel")-- is denied and the transaction is processed at my card's rate.

Remember that your home bank (the one issuing the card) sets your daily limit with you. If you haven't set one, you'll default to their standard withdrawal limits. That may or may not suit you, so clarify this with your institution before you leave home, where possible. Also, many institutions have a phone app that tells you immediately when a transaction is processed; mine include the details of the transaction as well as my withdrawal/cost in USD. I've already seen the DCC rate on the screen; now I have my card's rate in my hand. I compare the two and never has the DCC rate been advantageous--by 5% of the transaction. For example, on $500US, that's $25 USD difference.

If an ATM does not have sufficient funds, or funds in denominations sufficient to complete your transaction, a user might go through all the motions, only to experience the ATM choke and return the card without charging it or dispensing funds. Often insufficient funds is the reason (the machine was not refilled), which is why days around holidays or weekends are more problematic. This weekend, being Pay weekend (the 15th of the month), Buen Fin (extra shoppers using cash) and a three-day holiday weekend (Día de la Revolución) we will see lots of ATMS unable to dispense requested cash. Among other reasons, transactions don't complete due to a malfunctioning machine,  the card information is out of date, expired, damaged,  or incorrectly input; the transaction connection to the home bank to withdraw the funds isn't working or stable; a previous client's error zapped the machine...

Once you do your homework, you'll be able to determine which ATMs give you the most cash for your transaction.

 

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Sounds overly complex. My due diligence was quite simple: Scotiabank is the only Canadian  bank  with a committed presence in Mexico. Switched all our accounts to Scotia 1 year before moving. I also discovered that a Scotia ATM was in this neighbourhood and not only that all over the country. There is no charge to me for ATM usage. For a number of years this was great because the machine was swipe then push/pull. Scotia Mexico changed supplier and it became a grabber of your card. Opened an account at Intercam that is only 5 minutes further away than the Scotia ATM. Go to the teller window and get as much cash as we want in almost any currency. Perfect and quick and easy dealing with a human again because that's what I did in Canada where I never used an ATM ever.

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10 hours ago, FrankyOP said:

Okay so only hsbc and santander ask you if you want to accept/decline the dcc rate then?  

 

So you are telling me if say banamex you withdraw 5000 pesos and say the atm fee is 30 pesos to make it simple, say another bank like intercam also charges 30 peso fee for atm... then the rate you are getting your pesos is the same regardless?

 

Thus you withdrawing 5000 pesos from cibanco with the 17.40 peso fee... or banamex with 30 peso fee or another atm with 35 peso fee... you are getting the same peso rate?   The only difference is you are paying a bit less for the atm fee?  Thus if you want to withdraw 15000 pesos from cibanco vs hsbc and decline the dcc in hsbc... you get your bank rate no matter what and pay a bit less for the cibanco atm withdraw fee of 17.40 compared to 63.5?   Can others confirm this?

 

I had thought banks like banamex, cibanco which do not have that accept/decline dcc option would basically give you their bank rate peso rate...

 

Then why do ppl say banks like cibanco give great rates compared to other banks.  Like they give 18.2 etc.  Does that number mean exchanging another currency for pesos in person at bank?

 

 

 

Anyone who says an individual bank's ATM has a better exchange rate is in error. Maybe they are looking at the sign in the bank of the current rate.  You can check the exchange rate on the Visa or Mastercard web page and then check what the ATM gives you. Same at all ATM's  

At the banks teller's window they will have their exchange rate. It is different from their ATM.   

What you need to do is find the  most convenient ATM and use it. Withdraw $10,000 pesos and pay $30 pesos more is like  tipping a waiter. 

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Reminds me of the joke about the guy who made his wife promise that upon his death she would bury him with all of his money.  At his funeral the wife's friend turns to her and asked if she honored her promise.  The wife replies "Oh I forgot",  She then walked over to the casket and put a check into her husband's pocket.

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If you use a debit card at an ATM the exchange rate is assigned by the network that passes the transaction from Mexico to the regional network the authorizing bank uses. In most cases this is Plus or Cirrus. When the authorizing bank receives your request for cash, the amount requested has already been converted to local currency.

If you use your debit card as a credit card for purchases, the exchange rate is determined by the Visa or Master Card system. The authorizing bank also receives the request for money in local currency but in this case there could be a single or even double currency exchange fee tacked on. The latter is kind of weird and occurs in foreign tourist areas where items are priced in US dollars. There is a conversion (and fee) assigned to convert the USD to MXN pesos for example, and then the second fee to convert it back to USD. 

Currency exchange fees must be disclosed on your monthly statement. Surcharges or fees assigned by the owner of the physical ATM you use are just added to the amount you requested and are not disclosed on your statement. The only place you'll see a surcharge is on your ATM receipt.

I wrote ATM authorization programs for more than 20 years where each year introduced more and more complexities as well as clever ways banks made these transactions more expensive for consumers.

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Okay so to confirm.

 

1.  Only hsbc and santander will ask if you want to accept/decline the DCC rate right?

 

2.  If you withdraw 15000 pesos from HSBC and decline the rate which i done before... the atm withdraw fee is 63.50 pesos... you are withdrawing 15063.5 pesos.  And if you put that into google for usd to peso... then look at your online bank account, you notice the total amount deducted from your bank account is very similar to the google rate right?

 

Now if you withdraw 15000 pesos from cibanco... you pay the 17.40 atm withdraw fee.  So total withdrawn would be 15017.40 pesos.  So that 15017.40 pesos when you enter it to usd to peso on google... the amount you get deducted from your bank account would be the exact rate like the hsbc one?  Thus if the bank does not allow you to accept/decline the DCC rate, you are getting your USA bank rate?  

 

So you are saying the withdraw fee only when you withdraw 15000 pesos from cibanco compared to hsbc if you click decline dcc rate with hsbc atm right?

 

 

 

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Your USD peso to dollar exchange rate will not match any of the hundreds of websites that might display on a web search using google.  Use ether the Visa or Mastercard website. 

Every ATM has a different user fee.. I doubt anyone on this board will have a list of which banks ask the question about the bank's local rate.  If the ATM asks you to accept a displayed rate........ decline. 

 

If your debit card is Visa use this

https://usa.visa.com/support/consumer/travel-support/exchange-rate-calculator.html/

If your debit card is Mastercard use this

https://www.mastercard.us/content/mccom/en-us/consumers/get-support/convert-currency.html/

 

 

 

 

 

 

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7 hours ago, Mostlylost said:

Your USD peso to dollar exchange rate will not match any of the hundreds of websites that might display on a web search using google.  Use ether the Visa or Mastercard website. 

Every ATM has a different user fee.. I doubt anyone on this board will have a list of which banks ask the question about the bank's local rate.  If the ATM asks you to accept a displayed rate........ decline. 

 

If your debit card is Visa use this

https://usa.visa.com/support/consumer/travel-support/exchange-rate-calculator.html/

If your debit card is Mastercard use this

https://www.mastercard.us/content/mccom/en-us/consumers/get-support/convert-currency.html/

Exactly. To summarize, if your atm fees are reimbursed, get your money at any bank, and decline, if asked. If you pay the atm fee, get your money at the CIBANCO, if one is available. If not, the bank that has the LOWEST atm fee. Its really simple, don't make it hard ! :D

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Okay thanks for that information.  

 

But to confirm,

 

Say right now im at hsbc atm and withdraw 15000 pesos and pay the 63.50 peso atm withdrawal fee.  if you check right now 15063.50 pesos = $785.42 USD.  Whenever i go to atm and withdraw 15000 and pay the atm fee, when i check my us bank account online, the usd deducted from my account will always be around that $785.42 USD or so.  It usually off by a few dollars usually.  So that is right correct?

 

Say im going to hsbc atm and check my phone on google 1 usd  = 19.18 pesos.  Now let say after i withdraw 15000 pesos from hsbc atm, i immediately go to cibanco atm and withdraw 15000 pesos while the google rate for us and peso is same 19.18 pesos.  For the sake of this, let say my atm withdraw for my mastercard debit card is 2k a day.  It isn't, its only 1k.  But say it takes me 15 minutes to get to cibanco.  Now when i withdraw 15000 pesos and pay the 17.40 peso fee, 15017.40 pesos = $783.01.  So if i check my us bank account online statement immediately, the US amount deducted should always be around that amount right?

 

I ask this because back then when i accepted the DCC rate at hsbc atm, I noticed that the 15000 peso i withdraw and the atm fee i pay... where google shows like its around 785 usd to make it simple... it was like 825 dollars or so each time.  Again, back then i had no idea you can decline it... i thought if you did, transaction wouldn't go through.  So because of that, i paid like 40 dollars each time extra to withdraw around 785 dollars correct?

 

I ask this because i thought atms that dont ask you to accept/decline the dcc rate and don't give you the option... they give you their own bank rate such as cibanco rate or banamex rate as oppose to say your US bank rate.  So to confirm, you always get your USA bank rate right whether you use cibanco or any other bank that does not give you that accept/decline dcc option?

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Franky has been here before with long, convoluted questions that go into excruciating detail. Spoiler alert: no matter how detailed the answers, Franky will come back with even more detailed questions. He will never be satisfied with any answers provided. He will play this game as long as he continues to get people to respond. Have fun.

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Franky- it is pointless to post questions on a forum if you can't be bothered to read and comprehend the answers. And it's also disrespectful to the people who took the time to explain things to you to keep posting the same questions over and over again. 

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Sounds like someone that posts here from that the Yucatan board.

Playing with us.

 

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