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GringoTJ

Eliminating risk and buying land the safest way possible?

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I found some land that i will be purchasing with a bank trust, i have an agent that is very helpful, i wanted to be extra careful as i have come across reports of people losing their homes with no recourse, heck i found this article which explains Walmart and other large corps were screwed by a land deal, im sure they had a team of lawyers http://www.ensenada.net/noticias/nota.php?id=38756

Apparently the child forged the signature of the parent and the parent took them to court in which the contract was found voided since the signature was forged

In this article a person was selling land gotten through fraud for over a decade http://saidbetanzos.com/2018/05/21/aprehenden-a-defraudadora-de-villas-san-pedro-en-playas-de-rosarito/ so if some of them had attornies and the paperwork was so legit that they didnt even notice, do the buyers have any options?

 

The seller is asking for a $5000 deposit, for the deposit and final payment is it advised to ONLY use escrow?

I have looked into title insurance and some people say the coverages that it provides in Mexico are much less than in the US and that it may not protect you, if a distant relative comes asking for their property, you might have no recourse

Most people recommend getting an attorney and i definitely will but so did Walmart and they still had issues and lost everything

Is there anyway to buy land completely risk free in Mexico?

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Most people are correct: make an appointment with a licensed attorney who deals with these things and not some random stranger on a webboard after happy hour. 

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There is always opportunity risk.

yes you have investment risk

currency risk

political risk

it is sad that there fraud risk. that you have to worry about.

Best to know who you are dealing with.

Takes work to do your due diligence.

It appears the lawyer involved on the sons side, committed fraud and fooled everyone and was working for the son.

Fraud very rarely done alone, many times its a team effort.

I seen lawyers in the United states, do horrible things.

same down here in Mexico.

 

You have to know who you are dealing with.

Take time and get to know the family, who you are dealing with, do not rush into a deal.

 

If it to good to be true, run away from it.

unless you have a lot of cash and can afford to take the risk

 

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Title Insurance (like thru Stewart Title) has been available in Mexico. Just make that a condition of your offer to purchase.

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As to the advice above, you need a notario and not an attorney. You, as the buyer select the notario. Sign nothing,  not even an offer to purchase without a review by your notario.  And, ask notario his/her fee as by law they have a range of fees. 

Do not buy ejido (communal) land. Title insurance is no guarantee.

www.soniadiaz.mx

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You can  lower the risks substantially if you do a title search ( Historial) in Catastro and the Registro Publico.

A notary will not do this automatically you must pay extra or pay an attorney or someone that knows what they are doing. Notaries only order a clean title certificate.

The person you hire can go back sometimes more than 100 years. I would recommend at least 10 as that is when possession can convert to into property  ( Prescripcion) to see if there are any red flags.

If it is close to an Ejido you should have someone definitely double check.

If this is done you can lower the risk considerably. 

If there are problems with the property the seller is obligated in most cases to correct the problem or give the money back. Hopefully he still has it.

 As always check with a good attorney. 

 

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"Is there anyway to buy land completely risk free in Mexico?"  The short answer? No.

Never invest any amount of money in Mexico that you are not willing to walk away from. Because that's what you may have to do.

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18 hours ago, Sonia said:

As to the advice above, you need a notario and not an attorney.

 One needs both for reasons beyond this forum.

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Hundreds of real estate sales and transfer take place every year along the north shore of Lake Chapala. The pct. of incidents where something goes wrong is infinitesimally small in that area.

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On 7/24/2019 at 5:03 AM, Sonia said:

As to the advice above, you need a notario and not an attorney. You, as the buyer select the notario. Sign nothing,  not even an offer to purchase without a review by your notario.  And, ask notario his/her fee as by law they have a range of fees. 

Do not buy ejido (communal) land. Title insurance is no guarantee.

www.soniadiaz.mx

Others have mentioned title insurance, you mention that title insurance is no guarantee
Why is that? I would assume insurance is the best guarantee you have in protecting yourself

I am definitely staying away from ejido land

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Make an appoint to meet and actually talk to Stewart Title Mexico instead of reading about title insurance. I assume you are near Guadalajara so here is their contact in Zapopan:

Title insurance in the USA with clear property laws in just a numbers game like with any insurance. It is different in Mexico in that they actually research the title pedigree. Of course they will not accept all properties because of unclear title lineage, or cloud on the title. Were I shopping again I wouldn't touch a property the title company would not guarantee or insure. Mexico could clear up many of it's title problems by requiring properties to be registered in the municipal office with owner and contact information. Of course that would aid in collection of taxes. To allow an alleged owner to show up and claim a property, even though he/she, have never paid any taxes is just silly even though that is common here. In the USA there are many properties that you can not get title insurance on because of Title provenance and many or unknown owners.

Stewart Title, tel 333-682-1989, Av Vallarta 6503 Cory tower, Zapopan

Av. Vallarta 6503, Concentro, Corey Tower, 4th. Piso A 
Zapopan Jalisco , 45010 Mexico City Farm
Business Phone: 3336821989  

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14 hours ago, geeser said:

Make an appoint to meet and actually talk to Stewart Title Mexico instead of reading about title insurance. I assume you are near Guadalajara so here is their contact in Zapopan:

Title insurance in the USA with clear property laws in just a numbers game like with any insurance. It is different in Mexico in that they actually research the title pedigree. Of course they will not accept all properties because of unclear title lineage, or cloud on the title. Were I shopping again I wouldn't touch a property the title company would not guarantee or insure. Mexico could clear up many of it's title problems by requiring properties to be registered in the municipal office with owner and contact information. Of course that would aid in collection of taxes. To allow an alleged owner to show up and claim a property, even though he/she, have never paid any taxes is just silly even though that is common here. In the USA there are many properties that you can not get title insurance on because of Title provenance and many or unknown owners.

Stewart Title, tel 333-682-1989, Av Vallarta 6503 Cory tower, Zapopan

Av. Vallarta 6503, Concentro, Corey Tower, 4th. Piso A 
Zapopan Jalisco , 45010 Mexico City Farm
Business Phone: 3336821989  

Makes sense about steering clear of property they are not willing to insure, I had contacted Steward last mth and got this reply:
 

Good Morning,

 

Thank you for contacting Stewart Mexico. Currently we are only insuring commercial transactions in Mexico and unfortunately we would not be able to provide our product or services.

 

If you have any questions, please let me know.

 

Kind Regards,

 

Tanya M. Harris

Paralegal

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Well...that eliminates Mexico I guess for you.  Carry on.

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7 hours ago, GringoTJ said:

Makes sense about steering clear of property they are not willing to insure, I had contacted Steward last mth and got this reply:
 

Good Morning,

 

Thank you for contacting Stewart Mexico. Currently we are only insuring commercial transactions in Mexico and unfortunately we would not be able to provide our product or services.

 

If you have any questions, please let me know.

 

Kind Regards,

 

Tanya M. Harris

Paralegal

Thanks for that information. Sorry to hear they no longer do residential lots and homes. About !2 years ago when Stewart Title came to Mexico they sent a representative to speak to the Gringo community. Perhaps it was at LLoyds upstairs or LCS. Perhaps they just  had too many problems with Mexico property rights to survive in that market.

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SO no insurrance title for residential , not surprising and that tells you a lot.. Have a good notario ..

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Got a reply from this company that apparently does residential, they are backed by the Lloyds company from the UK:

Thank you very much for contacting Armour Secure.

Please send me your phone number and the best time to call you.

 

For Title Insurance the information and requirements as applicable:

 •            To insure an individual:

1.           Application form completed and signed

2.           A copy of the vesting deed (the last deed of the record) for the property to be insured

3.           A copy of the proposed insured´s ID

4.           Payment of the title search

 •            To insure a Company:

1.           Application form completed and signed

2.           A copy of the vesting deed (the last deed of the record) for the property to be insured

3.           A copy of the articles of incorporation of the company (or the equivalent) and a copy of the power of attorney

4.           A copy of the ID of the legal representative of the company

5.           Payment of the title search

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good luck to you. Good that you found someone, make sure they deliver before committing, backed up by Lloyd or anyone else..

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