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Mischiefmaker

Budgeting costs of reconnaissance

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26 minutes ago, ComputerGuy said:

"Cheat"? You mean going back to a place where my taxes still pay for medical coverage? And have my whole working life? That statement shows very little thought, I'm sorry to say.

Maybe I am wrong .  but my other Canadian friends tell me if you out of the country/province for more than...what 5,6 0r 7 months you forfeit your rights to health care..or not???

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That is true. However, as a Canadian citizen, if you decide to go back (for whatever reason) to live permanently then you notify the powers that be and your health care is reinstated within three months.

One of the requirements for officially becoming a non resident of Canada is giving up your health coverage... and most become official non residents to get the lower income tax rate. You can't have your cake and eat it too.

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To qualify, you must have lived in Ontario for more than six months and be away no more than 212 days in any 12-month period. Many people opt then to buy private insurance. If away longer, then as Ferret says... and this is key, because you don't forfeit your rights more than temporarily... you are reinstated after three months. As well, OHIP will even pay for many medical expenses incurred outside the country within the time limit. However, no Canadian is going to be turned away in cases of medical necessity.

Further, if you plan to be outside Canada for more than seven months in any 12-month period you can keep your OHIP coverage for up to two years if you will be in Ontario for at least 153 days a year in each of the two years immediately before you leave the country.

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13 hours ago, gringal said:

Poor people from the States are not trying to come to Mexico to do work that Mexicans won't do.  Enough said??  But keep on...and on.

Geez, that dog won't hunt anymore ! You gotta do a LOT better than that. But, keep on and keep on. You are not speaking to Democrats here, who will believe anything ! :D

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No, she's speaking to open minded people who know that health care should be a basic right no matter where you live or what your status is. America won't really be great until it achieves that like so many other forward thinking nations. Why hasn't it?

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33 minutes ago, Ferret said:

so many other forward thinking nations

So who are these forward thinking nations?

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Imho, yes. Healthy nations are usually more productive = less sick days = larger tax base. What goes around comes around. The stress of worrying about the "what ifs" is less. And stress is a complicator in all things medical and can even be the cause of them.

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Universal health care exists in a number of nations.  Google this if you're genuinely curious. We already know about Canada.

People who are against it are usually against the idea of anyone getting anything which they themselves might have to contribute to. The extreme viewpoints are against paying taxes for anything that is of general benefit.  I can only imagine that it wouldn't bother them to see those who are unable to pay or obtain insurance just die. That dog always hunts.

On the other hand, I am always appalled when someone who not only has no kind of medical insurance (even the nearly cost free Seguro Popular) and can't (or won't) pay out of pocket posts a plea on this web board or elsewhere for his fellow residents to cough up cash to pay for his or her medical care.  No excuse.

 

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Funny how people don't believe they might die, until they might die...

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Tiny edited his post so my answer to his query looks out of context. I will remember to quote him in the future. And yes, if he wanted to know "who" they are, it can be googled.

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Once upon a very long time ago, in my sailing days, I was docked in Montego Bay, Jamaica, and became very ill with the flu. Some very nice people took me to a hospital, where I was seen, X-Rayed and treated with antibiotics. I was charged $2.00 and recovered to sail olnward to Panama and through the canal to the Pacific Ocean and westward.

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If you are so lazy not to answer the question and just say "google it", it makes one wonder if you comment is true.

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17 minutes ago, Tiny said:

If you are so lazy not to answer the question and just say "google it", it makes one wonder if you comment is true.

Those too lazy to "google it" need to look in the mirror.  I don't need the answer, but apparently you do.😎

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It is these lazy people that provide a source when they make a comment like that.

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Let's face it: the U.S. government is just stingy and greedy to care about their own people. They've been feeding off the trough for too long, too long. And old report says thirty-two of the thirty-three developed nations have universal health care with the United States being the lone exception Even the Congo and Russia have free/universal health care, for crying out loud.

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6 hours ago, Ferret said:

Imho, yes. Healthy nations are usually more productive = less sick days = larger tax base. What goes around comes around. The stress of worrying about the "what ifs" is less. And stress is a complicator in all things medical and can even be the cause of them.

We were in Spain for 5 weeks this summer. Another thing is there the government has set it up that employees get 4 weeks of paid vacation, not 2 weeks which is common in the US if you are not in a union

 I chatted with a couple from Poland that were in thier late fifties and at that age they get 5 weeks paid vacation.

I also chatted with a retired couple from Ireland and in thier late fifties got 5 weeks paid vacation.

I wonder if they are/were happier and healthier than I was with my 2 weeks vacation and working most of the time?

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A report I just saw yesterday in the U.S. says that 32 hour work weeks consistently show better performing employees, happier, healthier, and more productive.

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58 minutes ago, ComputerGuy said:

A report I just saw yesterday in the U.S. says that 32 hour work weeks consistently show better performing employees, happier, healthier, and more productive.

You think it safe to say that these wonders will probably never happen in the U.S., which has a large block of true Scrooges and always has had?  It's TRADITION.😉 Consider the fact that a series of U.S. Presidents of both parties have made an attempt to install some kind of national health care and the semi-success of the previous one has now been gutted with further gutting planned. Even Mexico, with all its other problems, has managed to put in such a program.  Maybe lacking in frills and comforts, but with doctors and hospitals nonetheless.

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1 hour ago, ComputerGuy said:

Let's face it: the U.S. government is just stingy and greedy to care about their own people. They've been feeding off the trough for too long, too long. And old report says thirty-two of the thirty-three developed nations have universal health care with the United States being the lone exception Even the Congo and Russia have free/universal health care, for crying out loud.

I have long wondered and don't know the answer.  For the first 2 years of O's term the Dems had the presidency, the House and 60 seats (filibuster proof) Senate. Why did they not pass universal healthcare? Did the people not want it, did they not want to pay for it? I have never seen a good answer.

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1 minute ago, pappysmarket said:

I have long wondered and don't know the answer.  For the first 2 years of O's term the Dems had the presidency, the House and 60 seats (filibuster proof) Senate. Why did they not pass universal healthcare? Did the people not want it, did they not want to pay for it? I have never seen a good answer.

That's a very good question, and the closest I've come to an answer is that that too many citizens, while willing to spend unlimited funds to support a huge military machine, cannot bear the thought of in any way "being their brother's keeper". That is apparently a majority opinion or things would not happen the way they do.

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2 minutes ago, gringal said:

That's a very good question, and the closest I've come to an answer is that that too many citizens, while willing to spend unlimited funds to support a huge military machine, cannot bear the thought of in any way "being their brother's keeper". That is apparently a majority opinion or things would not happen the way they do.

That's kinda what I was thinking also.  So if that's what the majority wants the fault must lie not so much with the pols but with the greedy average Joe and Jane themselves. I guess the trick is to help Joe and Jane see how greedy they really are and get them to change their ways. Perhaps a tall task.

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11 minutes ago, pappysmarket said:

That's kinda what I was thinking also.  So if that's what the majority wants the fault must lie not so much with the pols but with the greedy average Joe and Jane themselves. I guess the trick is to help Joe and Jane see how greedy they really are and get them to change their ways. Perhaps a tall task.

How about an impossible task?  😎

I've just had a good lunch and am feeling generous, so for those are not only lazy as sloths but who like to goad me for the sheer fun of it, here's the two stroke effort I just took to google the matter in question:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_with_universal_health_care

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Thanks for the link, but I really think the task is not to tell folks what other folks have, but to convince them they really want it themselves. That's when they will tell their pols to vote for it.

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7 minutes ago, pappysmarket said:

I have long wondered and don't know the answer.  For the first 2 years of O's term the Dems had the presidency, the House and 60 seats (filibuster proof) Senate. Why did they not pass universal healthcare? Did the people not want it, did they not want to pay for it? I have never seen a good answer.

The U.S. did attempt to pass what was conceived of as Universal Healthcare but it got watered down through compromise and we wound up with the ACA/Obamacare. Since it was such a compromise it was challenged to perform from the beginning. Oh my God. Compromise. Never! Rather than taking what it provided and working to make it better many people objected to it out of hand. Often because they were against anything Obama tried to do.

Let's be clear. "Healthcare" is not the same as "Health Insurance". The cost and effectiveness of "Healthcare" in the U.S. is terrible compared to pretty much any other "developed" country. We have very high "Healthcare" cost, terrible results, and are trying to pay for it through insurance. In the insurance industry we often refer to "risk financing" as opposed to "risk transfer".

We eventually pay for the cost of "Healthcare" one way or another - or die because we can't. As an example since we don't provide something like universal health insurance we wind up with people not going to the doctor until they are very sick. They often wind up going to an emergency room which is the most expensive place to dispense medical care. Their outcomes, suffering, loss of productivity/wages, etc. is much worse than it needs to be. And we all wind up paying for that anyway. We would be better off if we had been willing to pay upfront. Left pocket / right pocket argument.

Finally, since the current push is to reduce the number of people with insurance, the cost for that insurance for those of us that do have it will go up. A couple of other insurance principles are pooling and spread of risk. The more people insured the lower the cost for each person. We are still going to have the same "Healthcare" cost but we are spreading it across fewer people, sending more people to the emergency room, causing already marginalized people to have even more problems that we pay for anyway.

I will turn the question around. Now that Trump is in the White House and the Republicans hold both houses why aren't they "fixing it": Dismantling Obamacare is only a solution if it is replaced with something more effective. Hmmm. Maybe "real" universal health care might be a good idea. But I would love to hear another plan. One of my dear friends who worked with me in the insurance industry is complaining that his "healthcare" is going up and blaming it on Obama. He know better but sees it through a political filter.

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Most understand the principle that the only way an insurance plan works is if it's spread over low and higher risk subscribers.  Allowing the low risk group to leave the pool guarantees very high costs to the others and eventual failure.  This is what's happening to the health care plan passed under the previous POTUS.  The new rates will be punishing.

I seem to remember a recent presidential campaign promise to provide "wonderful" health care for everybody. 

I'm full of wonder.😉

 

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