Driving mexican plated car to Canada

[LapazRico]

This whole discussion hinges on the difference between a resident or non-resident Canadian and how that is determined.

There is a good reference here -- https://moving2mexico.com/vehicles-returning-to-canada/

 

[RickS]

2 hours ago, LapazRico said:

This whole discussion hinges on the difference between a resident or non-resident Canadian and how that is determined.

... and not maybe how the Canadian Customs Agent at the border feels at the time?

 

 

 

[telcoman]

HMM, just out of curiosity what about a canadian vehicle that has since been nationalized in mexico? I od know someone who was truend back at th eborder. The mexican plated car was being towed by his RV, he had to store it in the US until he went back south.

 

I am wondering how the new USMCA may affect this: For greater certainty, no Party may adopt or maintain a prohibition or restriction on the importation of originating used vehicles from the territory of another Party after January 1, 2019. This Article shall not prevent a Party from applying motor vehicle safety or emissions measures, or vehicle registration requirements, of general application to originating used vehicles in a manner consistent with this Agreement.

[cedros]

It is a grey area-be prepared.

[RickS]

On 1/23/2020 at 11:25 AM, telcoman said:

I am wondering how the new USMCA may affect this: For greater certainty, no Party may adopt or maintain a prohibition or restriction on the importation of originating used vehicles from the territory of another Party after January 1, 2019. This Article shall not prevent a Party from applying motor vehicle safety or emissions measures, or vehicle registration requirements, of general application to originating used vehicles in a manner consistent with this Agreement.

I've now read this for the third time and I still have no idea what it might condone or consider illegal and for whom/where. What exactly might an 'originating used vehicle' be, and for whom?

 

[Mostlylost]

Since the public has not seen the finalized and signed by all three countries MCA, any interpretation now is futile. Wait for the final ratified version. Then see if Mexico observes the auto provisions because they did not fully observe the NAFTA provisions regarding auto importation.

[sem123]

I was the one that called the Canadian Government and posted  the email trail. And NAFTA 2.0 (as we Canadians call it ) won't change the fact that any car that has already been produced in Mexico won't meet Canadian safety standards, You can always call the Canadian Government to ask them for an update, the contact info is in the emails I copied in. My question is - do you really want to be driving a vehicle in Canada that "might" be legal (personally I think it would be illegal), and risk not being covered by insurance if you're involved in an accident. Why risk it ?

[Mostlylost]

18 hours ago, sem123 said:

I was the one that called the Canadian Government and posted  the email trail. And NAFTA 2.0 (as we Canadians call it ) won't change the fact that any car that has already been produced in Mexico won't meet Canadian safety standards, You can always call the Canadian Government to ask them for an update, the contact info is in the emails I copied in. My question is - do you really want to be driving a vehicle in Canada that "might" be legal (personally I think it would be illegal), and risk not being covered by insurance if you're involved in an accident. Why risk it ?

Are you referring to a vehicle being used for a vacation or imported and registered in Canada.

If it is on vacation and has US insurance which is valid in Canada and is allowed to enter by customs at the border then it is legal the same as a US certified vehicle that doesn't meed Canadian standards ie; KM speedometer, daytime running  lights

Maybe I don't get it, but if  Canada approves the importation and registration of the vehicle that is proven to meet standards for a used vehicle then it would be legal as well. 

Or what am I missing??

[sem123]

According to the Canadian government … currently, a vehicle manufactured in Mexico for Mexico does not meet the safety standards in Canada and CAN NOT be imported/registered in Canada. A Canadian resident (for tax Canadian tax purposes, not where they actually live) CAN NOT legally drive a foreign plated car in Canada even for a short period of time. Your insurance company will be more than happy to take your money but if you're in an accident you likely won't be covered.... your policy small print likely says something about the car has to be legal in the jurisdiction that it's being driven in. You can not buy insurance for something that is illegal. 

The new NAFTA may change this in that cars manufactured for the Mexican market may now have to meet Canadian/USA safety standards, but the existing Mexican cars will never meet the current Canadian safety standards, so will likely never be legal in Canada. 

So basically if you're a Canadian and own a Mexican manufactured and plated care and you want to drive in Canada rent or borrow a car.

 

[RickS]

5 hours ago, sem123 said:

snip...

The new NAFTA may change this in that cars manufactured for the Mexican market may now have to meet Canadian/USA safety standards.....

snip.....

 

I doubt seriously that this is a reasonable 'may change' to float around. While there are 'some' current vehicles made for Mexico here that do meet EPA/DOT standards.... and thus Canadian.... making ALL vehicle sold here conform is just not going to happen, IMO.

 

[cedros]

Also the different provinces have different regulations regarding this. 

[telcoman]

well may as well resurrect this. I am thinking it is different province by province. There is a guy in Calgary trying to sell an Jalisco plated vehicle back to mexico. They allowed him 3 months. Issue is the border is closed, but they may let someone transit with a resident card. BC ownt let you take one in, a friend had to store his below the border.

Maybe with the new NAFTA, rules will change.

Now I have a question. With residente permanente, can I drive a Canadian plated car in the Sonora free zone (No TIP required). I would like to store  a Mexican car in san carlos and do a swap over. I suspect if I can't all I have to do is add my son or brother to the registration and carry a letter.

[RickS]

I'm not sure that the "Permanente shall not drive..." law applies only to a non-Frontier location. BUT, since you will not need to stop at the border.... being a Permanente and not needing a TIP.... I suspect that you could easily drive the vehicle down to San Carlos without ruffling any feathers.

With respect to the 'swap over'.... it's not clear to me what you are trying to do/accomplish. What car is being driven where?

 

[RVGRINGO]

None of this is a good idea, as an accident will definitely ruffle feathers; yours, and there is no preening in jail.  There are rules for Residente Permanente, and it is best not to mess with them; especially if you have property and belongings in Mexico, etc.

[Out1]

On 2/4/2020 at 12:03 PM, RickS said:

While there are 'some' current vehicles made for Mexico here that do meet EPA/DOT standards..

RickS; can you let me know which vehicles made for Mexico meet the EPA/DOT standards; I would like to buy one.

[Mostlylost]

2 hours ago, Out1 said:

RickS; can you let me know which vehicles made for Mexico meet the EPA/DOT standards; I would like to buy one.

There is no list available. You would need to look under the hood for the USA federal emissions and safety stickers. My experience is it is mostly high performance models like Mustang Bullit  or Dodge Charger Hemi or Challenger Hemi, however there may be others. 

My nephew took his  Challenger Hemi when he moved to the USA and imported it. It had the Federal sticker for EPA & DOT. He still had to have a licensed inspection company certify it met standards as part of the importation process. 

Sample stickers. Some are black with white letters, 

[Out1]

Thanks, I know what to look for; been to just about every dealer in Guad and couldn't find anything with the DOT and EPA stickers.

[Heather Nesbitt Borquez]

Hi .. I am looking for an update for this post on Driving a Mexican Plated car into canada for a vacation. 

 

I plan to drive my MEXICAN plated car into B.C. next summer (post Covid) for 2 or 3 weeks.   After the vacation, I will turn around and drive my car back to Mexico.   I am Canadian.  The car is in my husband's name.  I have a Canadian driver's license.   I am a permanent resident of Mexico 

Is this possible?  And what do I need to produce at the Canadian (and American) border?

 

Thank you for all your help 

[telcoman]

19 minutes ago, Heather Nesbitt Borquez said:

Hi .. I am looking for an update for this post on Driving a Mexican Plated car into canada for a vacation. 

 

I plan to drive my MEXICAN plated car into B.C. next summer (post Covid) for 2 or 3 weeks.   After the vacation, I will turn around and drive my car back to Mexico.   I am Canadian.  The car is in my husband's name.  I have a Canadian driver's license.   I am a permanent resident of Mexico 

Is this possible?  And what do I need to produce at the Canadian (and American) border?

 

Thank you for all your help 

You cant if you are a canadian resident no matter what your mexican status. Especially in BC. You can drive it into the US and store it below the border. I have looked into it and so has a friend and were told no. If you have  a mexican DL and a BC one, keep it quiet and leave the mexican one in Mexico.

 

[RickS]

I presume that Telcoman is correct... as I have 'heard' the same thing. But if'n it were me I'd just call the Canadian Authorities and ask the exact question of them. I'd NEVER drive a vehicle from deep in Mexico all the way to the Canadian border on the advice of a Poster on a Mexican Forum!

 

[Travelero]

As other posters have mentioned, the answer hinges on whether you're a Canadian resident (under the applicable laws and regulations at issue, not necessarily for some other purpose like tax purposes). Under Canadian law, you'd be attempting to temporarily import your Mexican-registered vehicle if you arrived at a land border with it, intending to drive it into Canada as a Visitor. Visitor meaning the legal definition of that term under the applicable regulation, not whatever our practical/everyday sense of the word might be.

 

NAFTA does not apply to temporary importations. NAFTA is a treaty involving commerce, it does not touch on whether tourists can drive their cars across national borders for temporary stays. So NAFTA 2.0/USMCA only enters the picture when someone attempts a sale/permanent import/etc of a foreign vehicle.

 

The following excerpts are from the agency's own interpretation of Transport Canada's interpretation of the applicable federal laws, which means it can be expected to be most favourable to the agency itself and least favorable to you (that's simply how administrative law works in the anglo-saxon world, the agencies are always going to push for the interpretation that they prefer, you'd need a court case to challenge and refine their interpretation if it seems incorrect).

https://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/publications/dm-md/d19/d19-12-1-eng.html

 

Visitor

means a person who is not a resident or a temporary resident and who enters Canada for a period not exceeding 12 months.

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9. To be eligible for importation, vehicles must qualify for entry under one of the following two principles:

(a) vehicles that are required to be registered in the RIV Program, only applies to US specification vehicles purchased or originally sold in the US at the retail level or belonging to the category of Prescribed class of vehicle from Mexico (passenger car, MPV, truck or bus only);

(b) vehicles that are not required to be registered in the RIV Program applies to all other vehicle entries including CMVSS vehicles, age-exempt vehicles, non-regulated vehicles and vehicles imported temporarily.

--

 

Vehicles Entered Temporarily

67. Vehicles that enter Canada temporarily may or may not require a Vehicle Import Form – Form 1 or RIV e-Form 1 depending on the situation such as they need to be registered in the province or territory during their temporary entry. In such cases, the importer can submit a completed Vehicle Import Form – Form 1 or RIV e-Form 1 and indicate that the vehicle is not required to enter the RIV Program by checking the "visitor or temporary resident" entry box.

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68. A temporarily imported vehicle cannot be sold, gifted or otherwise disposed of while in Canada, does not qualify for permanent importation and cannot remain in Canada longer than the time constraints listed on a person’s work permit, student visa, or other CBSA entry documents.[...]

--

 

Vehicles Entered Temporarily - Visitors, Tourists and Temporary Residents

69. Vehicles may be admitted into Canada without having to comply with TC import requirements when they are used exclusively by a person entering Canada as a visitor for a period not exceeding 12 months; or temporary residents such as students studying at a learning institution, for the duration of their studies in Canada; or individuals with valid work permits/authorizations for employment for a period not exceeding 36 months.

70. Temporary residents and visa holders whose vehicle require licensing while in Canada, may submit a Vehicle Import Form – Form 1 or a RIV e-Form 1 at the border.

[canmex87]

If you are a registered Non Resident of Canada you may bring (on a temporary basis) a foreign plated vehicle into Canada.

[RichardF]

...the core of this boils down to who is considered a non-resident or resident. It's about where your live and your ties to Canada, not about how you do your taxes.

In general.....

If you own or rent a home in Canada, have dependent children in Canada, a dependent wife or significant other that you are not separated from living in Canada, a job in Canada, (most) Canadian utility bills in your name. a valid DL, insured car, membership in a social/club or political party membership .. then you may be deemed a resident of Canada  

To be deemed a non-resident you can't have the above BUT you can have a bank account in Canada and you can retain your Canadian credit cards. You should be prepared to show, if asked, your residency card, Jalisco or Mexican  State DL, proof of a Mexican residence/home such as CFE or Telmex bills, papers showing you own the car as plated... Do not bring up or discuss your tax filing situation... it is irrelevant.  You may need to convince a border guy you are indeed a non-resident citizen of Canada because the definition is not cut and dried. It can be subjective.