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Mexico is much smarter about immigration than USA or Canada


geeser
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Much and probably most immigration to the USA is for the FREE STUFF, like Welfare and Medicaid and WIC. Ending the freebies for non citizens would fix most of the problems. 87% of illegal immigrants and 72% of legal immigrants are on welfare. If the USA like Mexico required that you show financial ability to take care of your self and your family there would be less of a problem.

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12 minutes ago, geeser said:

Many and probably most immigration to the USA is for the FREE STUFF, like Welfare and Medicaid and WIC. Ending the freebies for non citizens would fix most of the problems. 87% of illegal immigrants and 72% of legal immigrants are on welfare. If the USA like Mexico required that you show financial ability to take care of your self and your family the country would be in better position. Didn't all of us immigrants have to show financial viability to get to be here? Foreigners also have to show continuing financial viability to renew their documents. When I take away the free sweet stuff those beautiful colibre leave or just quit coming.

Nice phoney baloney from  a non-journalistic rag

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My vote is to do away with all international borders, immigration departments, customs controls, etc.  We are one global family - there needs to free movement of people and goods to any place in the world to which people want to live, work and find happiness.  Maybe someday ......

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8 minutes ago, Ezzie said:

My vote is to do away with all international borders, immigration departments, customs controls, etc.  We are one global family - there needs to free movement of people and goods to any place in the world to which people want to live, work and find happiness.  Maybe someday ......

Gee! I wonder where most of the world would end up? 

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Mexico's immigration laws put Mexican citizens first.  I'm a strong believer and supporter of that philosophy.  Their country, their rules.

I can't understand why some folks can't grasp that other countries have the right to do the same.  No one is entitled to a double standard at the national border.

Ned, ad hominem is not a rebuttal.  It suggests the practitioner can't come up with a substantive rebuttal.  Try citing something that shows the data are incorrect or exaggerated.

Ezzie, here is your answer to that:

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwjFof2lna7SAhVqxFQKHTcbBNwQ3ywIGzAA&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DLPjzfGChGlE&usg=AFQjCNHep8a8BLtLSIkMekUoiKVTVVc9ig&sig2=VGktBvaMD_dX5ffNKu6zYQ&bvm=bv.148073327,d.eWE

I believe this has been posted here before.  It shows very definitively why the first world can't absorb the third world without becoming part of it.

The world is changing and the day of mass immigration as a solution for failed countries and cultures is ending.  Eastern Europe has already slammed the door shut.  Western Europe is in the process.  Globalism is in retreat.  The U.S. is no longer an empty country in need of mass infusions of people or labor.  Instead, the incomes of the middle class are falling and labor force participation rates and availability of decent full time benefit paying jobs are at historic lows.

The machines are well on their way to creating mass unemployment.  No one has figured out how people are going to have the money to buy the stuff those machines make if people don't have jobs and incomes.

Labor is subject to the laws of supply and demand.  If legal immigrants can't make enough money to support their families it is because the excessive supply of labor has reduced its value to the point that a great deal of the employment market isn't paying living wages.

It is hard to be optimistic about the future these days.

 

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3 minutes ago, johnnyg said:

Not anymore of a rag than the Washington Post or NY Times.

It's an excellent rag for persons of lessor intelligence to pat themselves on the back with. I would not insult my parrot by putting it on the bottom of the cage,if I had a parrot. I prefer the National Post,Edmonton Sun and Journal thanks.

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13 minutes ago, Ezzie said:

My vote is to do away with all international borders, immigration departments, customs controls, etc.  We are one global family - there needs to free movement of people and goods to any place in the world to which people want to live, work and find happiness.  Maybe someday ......

Yes Ezzie hopefully one day. If only people were less selfish.

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2 minutes ago, ned small said:

It's an excellent rag for persons of lessor intelligence to pat themselves on the back with. I would not insult my parrot by putting it on the bottom of the cage,if I had a parrot. I prefer the National Post,Edmonton Sun and Journal thanks.

Same comment Ned.  Ad hominem is not a rebuttal.  Where is your rebuttal?  Where are the data wrong?

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6 minutes ago, Mainecoons said:

 

Ned, ad hominem is not a rebuttal.  It suggests the practitioner can't come up with a substantive rebuttal.  Try citing something that shows the data are incorrect or exaggerated.

 

 

I made no rebuttal as there is no empirical evidence cited for the nonsense stats in this rag of no real journalistic expertise. I do see a big hug from what some of you call the alt-right though.

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Start jailing and fining American company executives that recruit and knowingly hire undocumented workers and things would change up north. Look at it this way: jobs with higher wages are like crack. Companies offer those jobs to undocumented workers, when the worker gets busted, they get punished, but the "dealer" of the job, just goes his merry way. Worst case scenario, they pay a fine, which they pass on to the consumer in the price of the goods or service they offer. Slap their asses in jail for a few years and see what happens. Few consequences for companies that hire workers illegally, the focus is on the employee, not the employer. I know this first hand, working in a small Nevada casino town that had a workforce from Zacatecas. 80% of the town was Mexican, who knows how many were documented. One casino would hide their workers in hotel rooms when INS did sweeps. And their owner sponsored the Republican Party dinner events. LOL. Another one had ties to a US Senator (R)  I spent 5 years watching this go on, no consequences. There logic was " nobody else will do the jobs" They even offered ESL classes.

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Exactly Zerbit.  And you are also pointing out that the U.S. has been a prime enabler of the illegal immigration they don't want now.  It's all about the money and only about the money.  Everything was hunky dory as long as the U.S. economy was growing so fast it was generating enough jobs for natives and immigrants, legal or otherwise.  Now it is becoming a struggle over limited resources, in this case jobs, and the other wild card are the machines that are replacing people at an exponential rate.

Just for fun I reread "Future Shock" by Toffler the other day.  His vision from 50 years ago about where things were headed was truly prophetic.  I really recommend this book.

I feel the U.S. has the right to set and change their immigration rules just as Mexico has and does.  I also think the U.S bears a very large responsibility for attracting people up there in the first place just as Mexico bears a very large responsibility for its failure to create opportunity for its people here at home.  Those millions NOB represent a big lost opportunity for turning hard working and energetic people into prosperity in this country.

Betty, it is not our place to protest Mexico's immigration policy.  Their country, their rules.  I believe it is appropriate to remind some who seem to forget that this right also belongs to their neighboring countries and no one should be surprised if those countries chose to also change their handling of immigration matters.  It is interesting to me that the professional and business Mexicans I know really understand this.

We are very close with an artisan family in San Martin, just south of Oaxaca.  San Martin is the premier alibrijes town yet half the people left and went to the U.S. because they couldn't make a living.  Our friends are considered among a handful of the very top artisans in their craft yet it is a constant struggle for them.  We've had the privilege of spending much time with them, their family and their relatives there in San Martin and having many interesting talks (while practicing our Spanish) with all of them.

I can tell you that they all place the primary blame for their friends and family having to go north on their own government.  

Regardless, I'm hoping that cooler heads will ultimately prevail and the folks here will appreciate the economic and social contributions the expat community makes to this country.  And the U.S. and Mexico will both take responsibility for what they brought to the situation and work out a fair compromise.

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29 minutes ago, Mainecoons said:

Thank you.  So you only have opinion, not fact.  Since the data are from census reports according to the source, are you suggesting the census data are "nonsense stats"?

What census reports,The center for Immigration Studies is a private organization with alleged racist and supremacist ties. Might i suggest that you do more research before making ad hominem statements. That rag has a less than stellar reputation as well, based on research,  not just my opinion after reading some of it .

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Read the citations.  Click on the embedded links and follow them.  The base data is from the census according to the base documents.

May I suggest you actually look at the data.  I am a little skeptical as to what is being labeled welfare but on the other hand there has been a huge expansion in the usage of food stamps up there, which is definitely a form of welfare.

This is the background document that seems to describe the methodology in detail:

http://cis.org/Welfare-Use-Legal-Illegal-Immigrant-Households

And also take time to look up the definition of "ad hominem."  Basically it is an attack on the source because one is unable to dispute the facts or opinions cited in a source.

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MC - are you still beating this drum, it is a topic you are obviously emotional about, but have very little knowledge, at least on an intellectual level and an understanding of international laws. Of course countries can uphold their laws, and protect their borders as they see fit. Canada has had great success in supporting immigrants and refugees from the Mediterranean - Palestinians, Armenia, Iran and yes, Syrians. The government of Canada has welcomed many times more Syrians than the U.S. - and they are a country 1/10th the size of U.S.A. About one year ago the Prime Minister of Canada personally welcomed a  a group of Syrian refugees - genuine refugees, proven and documented over a two year period. He gave the children toys and warm coats - the refugees were in awe. One year later he met with many of them again with them, and was moved to a tear or two on how successful their integration had become, and how glad they were to be in a living, breathing country again - their old one is rubble and corpses. That is Canada, and Canadians - and I am awfully getting tired us being mistaken as someone who would never dream of supporting, let alone voting for, someone like your President.

If you really want to get into a discussion of international migrations and the laws and treaties that Mexico, the U.S.A. and Canada have entered into. Here's a primer - guess what, migrants are considered to have human rights, Mexico stepped up its game a few years ago because of international pressure. Migrants have to treated in an internationally agreed upon way, as humans, because all humans have rights. The U.S.A. and Canada took it further with allowing appeals and hearings, it became a little part of something called "due process" - ever heard of that?

http://www.ohchr.org/EN/Issues/Migration/Pages/MigrationAndHumanRightsIndex.aspx

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Well Chillins, we'll see how this ends up for Canada.  Europe thought a lot of immigration was a good idea too.

Your country, your rules.  Canada is not the topic here but thanks for the information.  Now try being less angry and personal.

Interesting to see where your immigrants come from:

Chart 4: Foreign-born population in Canada, by selected regions of birth, 1951 to 2011

 

 

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8 minutes ago, Mainecoons said:

Well Chillins, we'll see how this ends up for Canada.  Europe thought a lot of immigration was a good idea too.

Your country, your rules.  Canada is not the topic here but thanks for the information.  Now try being less angry and personal.

Quote

Interesting to see where your immigrants come from:

Canada is a country built upon diversity - until very recent times, so was the U.S.A.

And maybe you should review the 5th and 14th amendments to your country's constitution. Now you are speaking for Europe - my god man, get over this.

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Not your Constitution either and if it were you would know that how the 14th has been applied by some courts is very much in question.

Since the current immigration enforcement programs in the U.S. are a continuation of those from the previous administration I'm curious as to where your angst about it was prior to January 20.

Try as I might I can't figure out what your point is other than you hate the U.S. President.

I'm not speaking for Europe, I'm just following the news from credible sources, namely not CNN or most of the U.S. media.  You might want to do the same.  Let Google be your friend.

 

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3 minutes ago, Mainecoons said:

Try as I might I can't figure out what your point is other than you hate the U.S. President.

I don't hate anybody, I feel sorry for what is going on in the U.S.A., it's like putting up with a drunken uncle, swearing and yelling at a family get together. Funny at first - then just plain sad.

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For once I agree with MC..

I also think Canada is to lenient letting in immigrants, they come for the free benefits.. Canada should have a policy like Mexico where you have to show you can support yourself while living in the country..

I personally know a couple from India who once they became Canadian citizens brought their parents who were in their 60's to Canada, when they reached 65 they were able to get OAS and GIS,  which are financial benefits paid to low income seniors, the seniors drug plan, free medical treatment without ever working a day in Canada... Just plain wrong...

                               Trump is doing what he was elected to do ...

                                         CONTROL IMMIGRATION 

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