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It got complicate by the fact that a third car was driving too fast the limit there is 60 and hit the van that swerved..The van was following too close but it did not hit me and  the third car that was passing everyone  hit the van which caused it to roll .. I would think if it is like France that the third car was at fault because it was driving way too fast and it hit the van. but who knows.. I will find out about the decision Thursday or Friday ..

If I had killed the dog and still had an accident the owner of the dog would be responsible but because the dog was still alive and I did not hit it , I cannot claim it was the cause of the accident and no one can go after the owner..one more screwed up law.. The owner should be responsible ... but it is the way it is. That is one version from the lawyer I am still going to look into that one.

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Please everyone, learn from this. Do not stop or try to avoid animals on the highway. A human life is worth so much more.

That is exactly why I never try to avoid animals on the Highway, as I have seen it go bad too many times. So sorry it was you. I feel really bad for those injured.  I assume you are ok, and the dog, t

Wow.You're a real defender of human rights. Anyone can wind up in jail as bmh has demonstrated. this last week the cops did sweeps of neighborhoods in Chapala where many of the nice people who work in

On 11/15/2016 at 10:18 PM, Crazydog said:

This is such a shit law! This makes me scared to drive here because even if it may not be your fault you still get treated like a criminal. I wonder if there are any possible ways to avoid going to jail in these situations? 

Note: you would think with laws like that, Mexicans would be the most careful drivers in the world, but my experience with the local drivers shows quite the opposite. 

You're absolutely right. It's like this in other Hispanic countries as well, I've read. They incarcerate people involved in traffic accidents until blame and

financial reparations are sorted and house them in third world holding cells like common criminals. People need to realize that this scenario could well happen to them VERY quickly especially with the unpredictable, erratic driving habits of a lot of Hispanic drivers. It is terrifying. That poor, older Mexican man with a ton of health issues should have been resting in a hospital bed, not some third-world jail cell with cement slabs to sleep on and no tp. Absolutely ghastly by any civilized standards I know. Mexico may not have capital punishment but their incarceration

practices/human rights violations are absolutely barbaric IMO. And yes, there IS a way to avoid jail. It's called hit and run. Flee the accident scene. Nice, huh?

 

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I to am sorry that this happened to you but I am surprised that it would take so long for a determination of fault. It has been a few years since I took courses in accident claims but the basic rules are still the same . The driver of the car is responsible for keeping control of his / her vehicle at all times if car 2 had to swerve he was not in control and bares a % of the blame as does the vehicle who was speeding and thus could not stop in time.  Those trying to place the blame on the dog are like the people who speed in an ice storm then blame the road conditions for skidding on the ice.  Driving is an awesome responsibility and we should never become complacent it is the reason I avoid driving through SJC in the evening so many sweet little children playing beside the road and cyclists  in dark clothing who cares who was at fault once the damage is done.  You are being a good sport after what you have gone through and I thank you for detailing your experience for the rest of us. 

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Yes that is what is interesting about the system..why would it take so long to have a decision? I guess it is a good oportunity to see how the system works here.. I was the lucky one in that accident so it is easy for me to say..but there are a few procedures here that are a little scary and hard to understand. I try not to drive at dusk or night, people are crossing roads not realizing that cars cannot see them and the little kids frighten me even during the day because I sure woud hate to run over anyone wether I was responsable or not.. 

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On 11/19/2016 at 10:13 AM, bennie2 said:

this is more fun than the american flag topic. there's no jail like a mexican jail! never a dull moment.

Probably worse in the world. At least they left out the rack and thumbscrews, but depriving people of the basic neccessities like food and water

are major human rights violations.

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They do let families bring food to the police..so they can claim they are not depriving people of anything...

When you see the state of cleanliness in the bathroom I would hate to have them cook any kind of food for me..

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36 minutes ago, hopeful Mex said:

Probably worse in the world. At least they left out the rack and thumbscrews, but depriving people of the basic neccessities like food and water

are major human rights violations.

I wonder what human rights organizations would think or do if they knew how bad the jail accommodations are in Mexico.  Perhaps Mexico is superior to third world countries.

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I have a feeling that jails are bad everywhere. The place in Chapala is a temporary holding tank where drunks are thrown in.. I do not know what the long term jails are like so I cannot comment.  Human Rights has to know what the jails are like and you do not see a whole lot of changes so I would not hold my breath about what Human Rights can or cannot do. 

I would not want to check out jails in Turkey or some Asian or African countries either..saying Mexico has the worst jails in the world is probably a gross overstatement.

I have a friend who son was thrown in Jail in Tabasco for 6 months while innocent, The Human Rights were involved, the Superior court was involved and what got him out what money so one thing is for sure once in the Gulag money is what you need forget all these great organizations.

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7 minutes ago, Yo1 said:

I wonder what human rights organizations would think or do if they knew how bad the jail accommodations are in Mexico.  Perhaps Mexico is superior to third world countries.

It's not pleasant when we or our friends and people we know get affected by jail conditions here in Mexico but if you care to follow any of the Mexican media you will learn that there are more pressing human rights matters than the jail accommodations you refer too. I'm sure the OP  knows this too with the experiences of Mexican people that she knows and has tried to help.

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Thank you for bringing this very important issue to our attention. I think we've been driving around "Paradise' blissfully unaware of the consequences of how one split second of someone else's wrong move could impact our life.

Time for us to look at buying cell-phones, and storing Spencer's number....just in case.

 

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By the way one of the cop in CHapala was taken by his parents to California at the age of 5 and he lived there until recently when he was deported, he lived in Santa Rosa, Sonoma county California and speak perfect English, He may become very helpful to people who get taken over there. My husband told me about him, I do not think I met him but he sounds like a God sent for those who do not speak Spanish,

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On 11/20/2016 at 1:34 PM, Crazydog said:

It's not the fact that Mexican jail is a shithole that bothers me, it's the fact that they send INNOCENT ppl in this shithole.

Wow.You're a real defender of human rights. Anyone can wind up in jail as bmh has demonstrated. this last week the cops did sweeps of neighborhoods in Chapala where many of the nice people who work in restaurants and shops live. We know some of them who were held for 2 days in the same conditons that bmh was in, without the help of lawyers or insurance agents . They were let go with no charges. stinky, cold, no food, mosquitos,no bathroom access, cement bunk with no blanket, and jeopardizing their jobs by not being able to show up or call. Not to mention taking care of family. We should all be outraged at the state of the jail and whatever happened to innocent until proven guilty? Even those eventually found guilty should be treated humanly as ill treatment debases those that perpetrate it as well as its victims. Anyone want to take on this important issue? Not as warm and fuzzy as kids or paint,but something that could make real changes. Amen.

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26 minutes ago, the walkers said:

 Anyone want to take on this important issue? Not as warm and fuzzy as kids or paint,but something that could make real changes. Amen.

OK - I'll bite. You would have to take personal responsibility first - you must confront fear and intimidation tactics with the same. This is hard work. If a dog or human is attacking yourself or someone you know or love, learn how to kill or preferably disable them, there are many ways, all of them earning a stain on your soul, and the eternal hatred of those who love that animal or person. Dealing with crooked cops, or a corrupt, broken system of law (which is a direct byproduct of a political gathering which has not adopted the "rule of law"*), you must play the game their way, passive and a pawn in their system. Or, as I have already stated, play them at their own game, which unfortunately for you is difficult in Mexico, without a century of family, political contacts and a very sophisticated culture of delivering favours. How does a nuevo/naiveo gringo deal with these state sanctioned bullies? First of all, do not tell them how "important" you are - that is the first sign of weakness. The second is losing your cool. Pull out a handwritten notebook, when you write down their name and police number, you say "you are Transito, Si?" your next immediate supervisor is "..." and his cellphone is "...", show the list to up to El Presidente if necessary, there is no end to corruption in this country, and most others, again a failing of the "rule of law"*. Not what you know - but who you know, even if you have to fake it. Would that help an innocent motorist or worker? I am going to say yes, absolutely - but - l also avoid driving myself as little as possible, and I have not taken the time and research to make up such a list. It should be public knowledge -transparency- until some :() calls the Governor to help get their kitten out of a tree. Much easier with a house and garden full of toys/joys, that is why we permanently moved here in the first place. We were "warned" by an  armed I.C.E. officer, at the Canadian/US border, that "they kill white people down there, just for fun!" -now what does that tell you?

* rule of law being a community decision to follow their agreed upon laws, without the need of fear and intimidation for enforcement. You do the crime - you do the time, as administered by your peers. Solid. No brainer. No "get out of jail" cards. It is seldom achieved, but well worth the journey, and again a collective community decision, well won by perseverance. Some very important people in Mexico say that this will occur in another 12 to 15 years. Working hard on health, and laying low, to make sure I see it.

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