gringal Posted November 24, 2015 Report Share Posted November 24, 2015 I've been given orders, so here is a fresh new thread. As I posted under the "dog friendly restaurants" thread, a question arises: There are laws here about "dogs in restaurants". Sometimes, restaurants are pressured by their customers to allow dogs in places where the law says "no", but the restaurant owner goes along with the customer's wishes anyway. I would appreciate someone who is a fluent Spanish reader telling us what the law has to say on the subject, what the fines are and who administers the law in this area. Based on that, which restaurants on the list are legally "dog friendly", and in which areas of the restaurant is it legal to bring your dog? When I lived in San Miguel de Allende, this issue became very contentious and heavy fines were levied on the restaurants which had bowed under pressure from their customers to allow animals in areas forbidden by law. The people who had pressured the restaurants did not pay the fines. This thread is NOT about how we feel as individuals about "dogs in restaurants", it's about what's legal....here in Lakeside, not in Paris or New York. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slainte39 Posted November 24, 2015 Report Share Posted November 24, 2015 Thanks for the effort to clear this up....I will try to help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gringal Posted November 24, 2015 Author Report Share Posted November 24, 2015 Thanks for the effort to clear this up....I will try to help. Appreciated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mainecoons Posted November 24, 2015 Report Share Posted November 24, 2015 Thank you both, I look forward to what you all find out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lexy Posted November 24, 2015 Report Share Posted November 24, 2015 I'm not really answering your query about what the law says exactly in Spanish. However some years ago Marcos, owner of El Sarape, very firmly told his customers that he could not allow them to bring their dogs into the restaurant according to Mexican law. He told us the health department came by his place and made it clear that he would be fined if he allowed customers to come in with their pets. He was clearly fearful of a heavy fine and fully expected to get one if he defied this law. Marcos has had his No Pets Allowed signs up for years now and he hasn't backed down. Maybe Marcos fears getting a high fine more than some of the other restaurant owners do who allow customers to bring in their dogs. But it's got to be a dilemma for these owners: Lose the customer who wants to bring in his or her dog and isn't allowed to or lose the customer who wants to dine without the presence of other people's dogs and makes that clear to the owner? Would it be possible for all of us, knowing that our pets are banned by law from restaurant dining rooms, self-enforce the law and leave our beloved dogs home alone for a few hours? Fido would soon learn that a real doggy-bag treat would be his when we returned. I'm serious. Lexy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gringal Posted November 24, 2015 Author Report Share Posted November 24, 2015 We do need to know the actual terms of the law, though. Self-enforcement would be wonderful, but..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lexy Posted November 24, 2015 Report Share Posted November 24, 2015 True. It's a great idea to try to get the translation into English of the actual law into our heads. And into the heads of some owners. I'm just saying that a Mexican restaurant owner like Marcos--who would like every customer he can get--isn't likely to ban dogs unless he had to, according to law. He can read Spanish. I'm looking forward to some clarity on this issue and thanks for trying to get it. Lexy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ginger Posted November 24, 2015 Report Share Posted November 24, 2015 I don't have a dog in this fight (ahem) as I don't bring any of my dogs to restaurants other than taking 1 to see Rick at Early Bird right after I rescued him a few years ago. I don't care one way or another but if I wanted a copy of the law, I'd pay a few pesos & see a lawyer to get the straight scoop rather than possible misinformation here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gringal Posted November 24, 2015 Author Report Share Posted November 24, 2015 I don't have a dog in this fight (ahem) as I don't bring any of my dogs to restaurants other than taking 1 to see Rick at Early Bird right after I rescued him a few years ago. I don't care one way or another but if I wanted a copy of the law, I'd pay a few pesos & see a lawyer to get the straight scoop rather than possible misinformation here. I am hoping that someone on here can provide correct information. Seeing a lawyer costs more than a few pesos, and shouldn't be necessary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cookie Posted November 24, 2015 Report Share Posted November 24, 2015 I thought they couldn't be in the "food prep" area. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RVGRINGO Posted November 24, 2015 Report Share Posted November 24, 2015 The devil is in the interpretation of the verb, elaborar, which is much fuzzier than the area de preparacion, and can inclued any dining area, especially if food is presented, revealed, enhanced, etc. I would not take the chance, if I were a restaurant owner. And, as a dog owner, I would not think of endangering his business. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ginger Posted November 24, 2015 Report Share Posted November 24, 2015 I am hoping that someone on here can provide correct information. Seeing a lawyer costs more than a few pesos, and shouldn't be necessary. Well, I live in that slum Riberas & you live "where the money is" but next week, I will go to Spencer & pay him to give me the Spanish as well as an English translation. Consider it a gift. Edited to add: I've emailed for an appointment with Spencer for Friday or Monday or whatever is available. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gringal Posted November 25, 2015 Author Report Share Posted November 25, 2015 Well, I live in that slum Riberas & you live "where the money is" but next week, I will go to Spencer & pay him to give me the Spanish as well as an English translation. Consider it a gift. Edited to add: I've emailed for an appointment with Spencer for Friday or Monday or whatever is available. Sorry, but the place "where the money is" is not on my lot. However, your gesture is appreciated. "The devil is in the interpretation of the verb, elaborar, which is much fuzzier than the area de preparacion, and can inclued any dining area, especially if food is presented, revealed, enhanced, etc." (RVGringo) Yes, that is where the problem lies. We need to know how the health dept. in this area interprets it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Saltos Posted November 25, 2015 Report Share Posted November 25, 2015 I think it's pretty simple: neither smoking nor mascotas are allowed in restaurants. Why not just put that statement in front of Spencer to see it it's true or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ginger Posted November 25, 2015 Report Share Posted November 25, 2015 Because since I'm paying, I'll get the info the way I want it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heidinrick Posted November 25, 2015 Report Share Posted November 25, 2015 Hi, this is Rick, formerly of The Early Bird Cafe. When the "law" came out about dogs and smoking I talked with the people in Chapala that issue your business license. Two of them came to our restaurant and said dogs were no problem as long as they weren't in the food prep area. They also said that we could allow smoking in our patio area but we had to have a sign showing our inside, designated non-smoking section.There was a door connecting both areas..that door had to be closed if there were diners inside and someone smoking on the patio. Believe it or not, this inspection was done with no money changing hands and with our attorney present! Maybe things have changed??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyle Posted November 25, 2015 Report Share Posted November 25, 2015 Maybe that is why we don't see Roberto's dogs at his restaurant any more, they were always in the kitchen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
artsnob Posted November 25, 2015 Report Share Posted November 25, 2015 Roberts dogs were there 2 weeks ago, They know I have bisquits in my pocket, and came running up to me with lotz of licks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyle Posted November 25, 2015 Report Share Posted November 25, 2015 Sorry, but I don't like to eat where dogs are in the kitchen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gringal Posted November 25, 2015 Author Report Share Posted November 25, 2015 Sorry, but I don't like to eat where dogs are in the kitchen Last few posters: can be carefully back away from saying what we like or don't like and whose dogs are in the kitchen? This is, hopefully, trying to find out where dogs are legally allowed, or not. I think we all know they aren't in the kitchen legally. Probably not draped on the floor in the kitchen doorway, either, where the waiters have to step over it. How about waiting to get the word from the attorney, via Ginger? It would also be good to see a good English translation of the law itself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MtnMama Posted November 27, 2015 Report Share Posted November 27, 2015 I also leave the dogs at home, where they can't tell total strangers that I only feed them every other day and YES they would love a handout. I wonder if there is a difference between a sidewalk area like Salvador's and a patio where patrons and dogs walk thru the restaurant proper. Just a thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gringal Posted November 27, 2015 Author Report Share Posted November 27, 2015 I asked this question elsewhere and received this answer from a man whose wife worked for the Secretariat de Salud as an administrator for 28 years. "The Secretaria de Salud has rules against dogs entering restaurants in all of Mexico. It is prohibited by the sanitation laws." (I am hoping to receive a copy of the law, translated into English, from the same source, but haven't as yet). Sounds pretty clear, though. Therefore, there are no legal "dog friendly" restaurants. (or maybe, if the dog is accompanied by a gringo, it is "exempt" from the rules?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bournemouth Posted November 27, 2015 Report Share Posted November 27, 2015 Which makes the situation of restauranters who live on the property and have dogs, illegal. I think we should all consider "unintended consequences" and kindly let the matter drop before the eyes of authorities are drawn to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gringal Posted November 27, 2015 Author Report Share Posted November 27, 2015 Which makes the situation of restauranters who live on the property and have dogs, illegal. I think we should all consider "unintended consequences" and kindly let the matter drop before the eyes of authorities are drawn to it. I don't see how that follows. If the owner's dogs are not allowed in the restaurant, then the law doesn't affect them. If they are allowing their dogs to roam the restaurant, they should stop doing so. Nobody is going to lose his livelihood by confining his pet to the outdoors or his living quarters, so I don't see a real problem for the restaurant owner. If there are customers who are fond of petting the owner's dog during dinner, it might be a tiny sacrifice they could live with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bournemouth Posted November 27, 2015 Report Share Posted November 27, 2015 When customers are seated in the great outdoors, it becomes part of the restaurant - no dogs and perhaps no donkeys?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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