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GeckoGretchen

Old issue obviously never resolved

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can you tell us more on this new ex pat dept? if its a municipio thing would have thought they would invite expats to go there and not the other way around.do we really need people for every zone and issue? anyway i have sent you a pm to see if i can help in some waybut i am not one for committees trying to make this place into gringolandia, but a dialogue with the municipio is appreciated and hope all goes well.

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The expat office director hasn't an office as yet. Today we talked about her setting an official time to be in Ajijic to address expat needs.

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The expat office director hasn't an office as yet. Today we talked about her setting an official time to be in Ajijic to address expat needs.

LCS should offer this person gratis space on their grounds for at least one day a week.

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She plans to work out of the Delegado's office as he should be involved in solving problems.

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I'm at the beach until Sunday afternoon but will get plugged into this on my return. Regardless of what non residents and non affected think, acoustic assault staged by outsiders should not be tolerated here or anywhere else for that matter.

And Alex, a "concert" that goes for 8 hours and ends up with milling mobs and trash everywhere is a lot more like a Rave than a normal musical event. Please feel free to contact City Hall and ask them to move these events to your town, thanks.

It is HOT here, the water is like a bathtub and the air temperatures are like nothing we've experienced in our 8 years of going to the beach at this time of year. El niño is the real deal down here at La Manzanilla. Town has made great progress in recovering from the storm but things are pretty dead here.

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Alex -- did you even bother to read through the entire thread of this? And now you say: "I don't know how loud these concerts were..." and then, "but I'm sure they qualify..." Why are YOU even interrupting this extremely serious thread/post about something you just admitted you don't know about, but have a certainty about the holders of these eventos? Get off this thread, you ridiculous, admittedly ignorant-of-the-situation, person. I live close by the Charro. I have for 11 years. NEVER in those 11 years have we experienced such an assault of public drunken NOISE, escalated by insanely giant speacker technology. The announcers are two increasingly drunken $%&/()s screaming and hooting into megaphones directed into giant speakers. This is not "Mexican Culture" This is an excuse for public drunkenness, and belligerent idiocy for money, that is an actual physiological assault on ANY human within 6 blocks of them. Babies are having anxiety attacks. Kids are so exhausted they can't concentrate in school the next day. People have to get to work early and are exhausted. YOU GET OFF this conversation that you admittedly know NOTHING about, and go do something productive for your community.

I was referring to decibel levels. I do not know what the decibel level was at these concerts...and neither do you. Seems to me that determining the decibel level of these concerts would be the first step. If they are exceeding 100dB, then you do indeed have a valid complaint to make to city hall.

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We live a couple of blocks away from Lienzo Charro. We walked over to near the intersection of Revolución with Camino Real, right in front of the old adobe house there. With an iOS app, the decibel level at that location was lower to mid 90s. And that was still almost a block south of the venue. In the time we've been here, there has never been anything this loud take place in the bullring.

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And Alex, a "concert" that goes for 8 hours and ends up with milling mobs and trash everywhere is a lot more like a Rave than a normal musical event. Please feel free to contact City Hall and ask them to move these events to your town, thanks.

Still sounds like very few people understand what these events actually are. Photos and videos here, and no you don't need to have Facebook to see the page:

https://www.facebook.com/pages/Lienzo-Charro-De-Ajijic/165674036919181

They go on for 8 hours because they involve Sunday afternoons, family, music, the cowboy association, horses, music, drinking, and partying. They are rodeos, sometimes involving several thousand Mexicans depending on the "outsiders" that come to town to play. These are totally normal "musical events." Whether in the past month the events are actually louder and exceeding the legal limit is another issue, but you all would be well-served to approach this issue from an edified point of view. You aren't dealing with just some "drunks" or bullies or rowdy kids or mobs here, as it's been put.

By the way, not exactly sure what you meant by "outsiders." Surely the only outsiders here are us gringos interested in maintaining our own kind of acoustic assault on the town. As a Mexican told me on his own accord the night before last, "I don't know why there are some gringos who come here and they want to bring their 'rules' with them. When I go to Chicago, I don't want to eat tacos and drink beer. I drink Robert Mondavi and eat pizza. And I speak English."

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The outsiders are the people who have started staging these events and I'll wager for the most part the people who are attending them. Thanks for asking.

BTW, the 8 hour Rave style event started at dark and went to 1:30AM on a school night. If you had been one of the lucky neighbors you would have known this.

You would have also known that starting with the full scale Rave that basically laid waste to the soccer field and surroundings over by Seis Esquinas, it appears that our "local" government has been handing out permits for similar volume wise if shorter events at the Lenzo Charro one after the other. Formerly, these concerts would start in the late afternoon and conclude around sunset or early evening.

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I was referring to decibel levels. I do not know what the decibel level was at these concerts...and neither do you. Seems to me that determining the decibel level of these concerts would be the first step. If they are exceeding 100dB, then you do indeed have a valid complaint to make to city hall.

I don''t need to know the symbol for oxygen is O2 in order to know I'm suffocating if I'm in a place without O2. I will still suffocate. And so will you.

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Are these "outsiders" Mexican or what? So the music and the attendees are all outsiders? or outside of the 30 neighbors?

Mexican tradition? Tradtion usually evolves in almost all societies and civilizations.

Loud noise is loud noise but why all these rationalizations?

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Are these "outsiders" Mexican or what? So the music and the attendees are all outsiders? or outside of the 30 neighbors?

Mexican tradition? Tradtion usually evolves in almost all societies and civilizations.

Loud noise is loud noise but why all these rationalizations?

Ha ha - you're right, slainte39. I like your point. There is no need for all these rationalizations. It's just way too damn loud beyond reason. .

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Poe, what Alex was referring to was the noise level for which you and others can seek legal recourse. You may not like it even at levels far below 100dB but you will not have the law behind you.

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Poe, what Alex was referring to was the noise level for which you and others can seek legal recourse. You may not like it even at levels far below 100dB but you will not have the law behind you.

Xena, I get that, but what I'm saying (and KBleitch did record the decibel level from over a block away with a meter -- behind walls), is that without having a scientific reading,our bodies can tell us that these have been way over the decibel level. it wasn't just the other night. It started several weeks ago, particularly on Sundays. But yes, now having experienced these, we'll get meter readings for the upcoming events.

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You all have my sympathy. This noise level sounds as though it has gone over the top. There just is no need for anything to be that loud.

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Are these "outsiders" Mexican or what? So the music and the attendees are all outsiders? or outside of the 30 neighbors?Mexican tradition? Tradtion usually evolves in almost all societies and civilizations.Loud noise is loud noise but why all these rationalizations?

I understand the noise complaints,but gringo expats

referring to Mexicans as outsiders is a bit much...

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They are outsiders to Ajijic and Lakeside. They are abusing the hospitality of both Mexican and expat here. If Guadalajarans want to deafen themselves, we invite them to do it in their community, not ours.

Can't imagine why this is so hard to understand. But maybe if you actually lived here and experienced what has been going on lately, you would.

I'm being contacted by both expats and Mexicans and we will see what can be done about getting rid of this latest nuisance.

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This is what a rave is:

Try, no really try, to listen to that music for even three minutes at high volume. Then imagine it for 10-12 hours non-stop, then imagine it going on for 3 days non-stop. Did something like this happen at the Charro Ring in Ajijic?

It wasn't a rave. Or even "rave-like". And I'm tired of people using that word just to inflame the subject when they don't know what one is.

There is no question. It was a LOUD concert. I sympathize with those who live nearby. I could hear it plentifully where I live, and that's about 5 blocks away. But I expected it, knowing it would happen. I KNEW I wasn't going to be able to sleep early that night. So I adapted my schedule. How hard is that?

And by the way, for a lot of the local community, 1-1:30 a.m. isn't late at all, even on a "school night".

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From Thailand?

LOL

From Wikipedia:

A rave (from the verb: to rave) is a large dance party featuring performances by DJs and occasionally liveperformers playing electronic music, particularly EDM. The music is amplified with a large, powerful sound reinforcement system, typically with large subwoofers to produce a deep bass sound. The music is accompanied by laser light shows, projected images, visual effects and smoke machines. While some raves may be small affairs held at clubs or private residences, some raves have grown to immense size, such as the Castlemorton Common Festival in 1992. Some electronic dance music festivals have features of raves, but on a large, often commercial scale. Raves may last for a long time, with some events continuing for ten hours. Due to the association of illegal party drugs such as MDMA (ecstasy) and the use of non-authorized, secret venues for some raves, such as squat parties at warehouses, law enforcement attention has been directed at the rave scene in many countries.

Note the "long time" with an example of 10 hours given.

And the description of the sound system. The subwoofers were the one vibrating my bed from blocks away.

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From Thailand?

LOL

I know what a "rave" is. Do you?

I try very hard to choose my words carefully. Therefore, good bye.

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This is what a rave is:

And this is what an Inolvidable concert is:

Inolvidable headlined the much-maligned November 22 concert at the charro stadium in Ajijic. If you live in Guadalajara, you have many opportunities to see these big-name banda groups, but out here in el campo, such shows are rare and cherished events. From the information presented in this thread, it's plainly evident that the concert promoters complied with all the legal requirements. I haven't heard of anyone being shot or trampled by the "drunken" crowd. Unfortunately, a few people who live near the stadium were inconvenienced. The same type of inconvenience could occur to anyone living near a football stadium in the U.S. or Canada...or anywhere else. So maybe we should all just get over it.

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I think many folks forgot the real rave that went on for two days a year or so ago . Remember folks?? Also Alex I know what a rave is I was a Black Rock Ranger at Burning Man for years and we had a rave in Ajijic that upset the community for days. Very unfriendly young people attended and they behaved poorly in town. I spent hours picking up trash in town. We are aware of having over the top events and its effect on the community. I lived next to OSU football stadium and this was easy compared to living with a rave or overly loud band. More than a few people were upset over the music on the 22nd. It was very loud miles away. I am very noise tolerant but sometimes things are just too much.

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The outsiders are the promoters and the people they truck in. More and more expats are becoming dual citizens and when you have planted your roots , paid your taxes and supported good causes you are no longer an outsider.

I talked to the president of the Charro to warn him of the coming storm. He says what happens is the promoters, once the people are good and liquored up offer to play longer for more money which is gladly handed over by the drunks. He is fine with the laws being enforced and would appreciate it. He says that during these extended events is when the damage is done, fights occur, trash is thrown etc.

He agrees to keep to the four hour rule, usually 8-12, with lowering of sound even more after 11. He has tried to eliminate the speakers, but, it is out of his control and up to the promoters.. It is their feet that have to be held to the fire.

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Uh, Harry, it would seem to me that the owners/operators of the property are the primary responsible parties. They are the ones booking these events and letting them blare out of control. Sorry, but I'm not buying the argument the promoters are responsible. They go where and do what they are allowed in by the venues. It is the responsibility of the venues to set the requirements for hours, sound levels and crowd control.

And the Lenzo Charro simply isn't upholding that responsibility or controlling what is going on at the property.

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