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Hud

Mexico Doesn't Apologize for Deportation

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Alex, have you actually been reading this thread? Your comments don't seem to fit what has been said here. Maybe you are on another thread? No bickering, division, claims of racism, etc. here toward Mexico enforcing its immigration policies and deporting illegals. All the hassle seems to be NOB. What is you point? You missed this boat, big time.

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Guest bennie2

hud, several people respond that way to these discussions. theres a disconnet. some folks havnt turned on the news in 20 years. if they do, it would be some propaganda shill re-enforcing the big lies. they wont look @ all sides. there are 100s of sources available, much better than the link. if the thread stays open or theres another i will provide reliable sources. people dont want to leave their comfort zone. not pointing a finger @ any one person here, but its inherently evil for people to remain so stupid. (EDITED, ADDED INFO)

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Hud, I actually read every post and every article that was referred to in this thread. I even read Bennie's posts, which I tend to ignore. How 'bout you? Did you read the article prepared by the Migration Policy Institute, which I referred to three separate times? Here's another opportunity to read the article. In fact, I urge everyone who has been following this thread to read the article. It will help you sort out fact from fiction on the issue of immigration in the U.S.

http://www.migrationpolicy.org/article/frequently-requested-statistics-immigrants-and-immigration-united-states

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Hud, I actually read every post and every article that was referred to in this thread. It will help you sort out fact from fiction on the issue of immigration in the U.S.

There it is Alex. We have been talking about MEXICO enforcing their own immigration policy and deporting illegals in MEXICO. You just thought you read and assumed you understood what we were discussing. You missed this boat, Alex. Say good night, Alex.

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So I take that as an admission that you did not read the article prepared by the Migration Policy Institute. Which proves the old adage that goes something like this: "You can lead a donkey to water...but sometimes he just wants to drink the Kool-Aid."

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Guest bennie2

do people know about obama's muslim re settlement program? 9,000 per month coming in for the last several years. you cant reconize parts of the midwest. this does not include the newer syrians who will be admitted. there are about 9 goverement agencies for this not including the religious orgs (who are fed funded). i wonder if this report even mentioned that? its just not true. been to the airport in utah lately? (just like good ole mexicana)

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Bennie,

For newbees, a bit of explanation regrading cbvijero's post. I have no idea where this person is coming from. In 2012 there was a link on the bottom of the chapalaweather page to some political cartoons, NOT a blog, my blog was oneblueflower and nothing political, only a blog of my life in MX which essentially no longer exists. On the link, you couldn't get to the cartoons without clicking through the warning page - which tells you a little about this person. The warning page before entering warned not to enter if you were going to be offended and not to complain because it was what it was.

The weather site since 2007 has been a public service to the Lake Chapala community at my expense and even now that I'm no longer a resident it continues. But apparently some people can't get over themselves.

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From Alex's MPI source:

SPT-FRS2015-T2.png

Would wages be stagnating and the numbers of discouraged workers be so high if the U.S. wasn't importing so much competition for too few jobs?

Are policies which do so appropriate for a government which is supposed to put the best interests of its citizens first?

Here's a visual presentation from MPI that can show various things:

http://www.migrationpolicy.org/programs/data-hub/charts/top-25-destination-countries-global-migrants-over-time

Although the U.S. clearly has benefited in the past from immigration, when jobs were plentiful, it is fair to ask whether the situation now is too much of a good thing. Stagnating or even falling wages in those job categories heavily populated by migrants and the high participation in aid programs because of poor pay and job opportunities of both natives AND migrants suggest that you can get too much of a good thing.

Don't be fooled by those misleading unemployment figures based on the U2 computation. It neither reflects how many of the jobs are part time, how poorly they pay or how many people have left the work force because they are discouraged. The U6 unemployment rate, currently running over 10 percent after 5 years of an alleged recovery is the much more accurate measure.

Should a country with 10 percent or more real unemployment be importing still more labor?

Respectfully, I think not.

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Bennie,

For newbees, a bit of explanation regrading cbvijero's post. I have no idea where this person is coming from. In 2012 there was a link on the bottom of the chapalaweather page to some political cartoons, NOT a blog, my blog was oneblueflower and nothing political, only a blog of my life in MX which essentially no longer exists. On the link, you couldn't get to the cartoons without clicking through the warning page - which tells you a little about this person. The warning page before entering warned not to enter if you were going to be offended and not to complain because it was what it was.

The weather site since 2007 has been a public service to the Lake Chapala community at my expense and even now that I'm no longer a resident it continues. But apparently some people can't get over themselves.

I can confirm what Giltner is writing here. The warning page existed and it was necessary to click through it to access the material. I recall it clearly.

Alex, I did read your entire citation and think it is a pretty good compilation. I also think it supports my view that there is too much immigration in the U.S. at this time, and for some time, given the amount of work available there.

I don't buy the argument that citizens up there are being displaced because they are less worthy. IMO they are being displaced because they won't complain about poor pay and working conditions. Yes, some of them need remedial training as well to be useful job holders. However, by the same token, much of the current flow of immigration is very poorly educated as well.

Because government is allowing immigration to create a large labor surplus employers are able to get away with exploiting working people. It is no accident that big business supports continued excessive immigration. They are making out like the bandits they are from it.

I think all this heavy immigration to the U.S. has mainly benefited employers at the expense of the general population and the middle class. The proof of this is the declining participation of citizens in the work force, the proliferation of poor paying part time work and stagnating pay.

Too many hands, too little work. That's the bottom line in America today. And that surplus of hands is totally a product of having the highest immigration in the world, a rate which is well beyond the capacity of a slow growing economy to assimilate.

A government that allows this, let alone encourages it, is not discharging its duty to its citizens IMO.

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The "Government" is doing nothing - businesses request the facilitation of hiring an immigrant employee and the government complies. What the government gets out of it is a reliable tax revenue, paid before the employee even gets their paycheck. It might take a generation before that employee realizes what a chump deal this is, and opens business for themselves with full deductions and paying minimal taxes.

Today, the skilled trades are where the big hourly wages are. The "Natural Resources, Construction and Maintenance". A journeyman plumber will earn much more than a junior human resources manager These trades are protected by a number of obstacles such as trade qualifications (compulsory years of experience, exams, licensing, big unions) and cultural barriers (often outright racial and sexual prejudice).

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BTW I want to personally thank Steve for establishing the local weather site and seeing that it continued even after he returned to the U.S. It is a very valuable thing to have and FYI as of this morning it has recorded more than 40 inches (1019.3 mm) of rain.

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That's correct. The government is doing very little to stop illegal immigration and it is permitting excessive immigration by permitting it. In fact, they are facilitating it at the expense of American citizens.

Hence you see stories like Disney laying off American workers and replacing them with lower paid H1B immigrants.

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This 11 million of illegals, that has been the number since Clinton was in the grasp of "that" woman. Wonder how it has remained the same with all the millions being added in these last years?

Because since 2008, more Mexican illegals are leaving the U.S. than entering.

http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2015/07/15/what-we-know-about-illegal-immigration-from-mexico/

The number of Mexican immigrants living in the U.S. illegally has declined. In 2012, 5.9 million unauthorized immigrants from Mexico lived in the U.S., down about 1 million from 2007. Despite the drop, Mexicans still make up a slight majority (52% in 2012) of unauthorized immigrants. At the same time, unauthorized immigration overall has leveled off in recent years. As a result, net migration from Mexico likely reached zero in 2010, and since then more Mexicans have left the U.S. than have arrived.
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alex, so the 100s of 1000s of refugees coming to the US is what mex does? so mex has open door? most illegals in US, if deported, come right back. (even if they are felons). right, US doesnt have muslims, 3rd world gangs. guess its just too shocking for most expats to even digest. ok, whatever....

Most illegals are not criminals, but those who are have been deported in record numbers.

More non-Mexicans than Mexicans were apprehended at U.S. borders in 2014, the first time on record this has happened. In fiscal 2014, 229,178 Mexicans were apprehended, a sharp drop from a peak of 1.6 million apprehended in 2000. The decline in apprehensions reflects the decrease in number of unauthorized Mexican immigrants coming to the U.S.
Even as border apprehensions dropped, deportations of Mexican immigrants reached a record high in 2013 of 314,904, up from 169,031 in 2005. This is due in part to a 2005 shift in policy that has increased the chances of being deported following apprehension in the border region, instead of just being sent back without an order of removal.
The Obama administration deported a record 438,421 unauthorized immigrants in fiscal year 2013, continuing a streak of stepped up enforcement that has resulted in more than 2 million deportations since Obama took office, newly released Department of Homeland Security data show.
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viajero is just typical of the anti american predictable pandantic brainwashing rhetoric he may have picked up in college.

Bennie,I am not anti-American in the least.

But I do believe that the extreme right is doing a great disservice to my country.

My apologies to the board if the above violated forum rules but I don't know how else to respond to accusations that I'm "anti-American".

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Although the U.S. clearly has benefited in the past from immigration, when jobs were plentiful, it is fair to ask whether the situation now is too much of a good thing. Stagnating or even falling wages in those job categories heavily populated by migrants and the high participation in aid programs because of poor pay and job opportunities of both natives AND migrants suggest that you can get too much of a good thing.

Don't be fooled by those misleading unemployment figures based on the U2 computation. It neither reflects how many of the jobs are part time, how poorly they pay or how many people have left the work force because they are discouraged. The U6 unemployment rate, currently running over 10 percent after 5 years of an alleged recovery is the much more accurate measure.

Should a country with 10 percent or more real unemployment be importing still more labor?

Respectfully, I think not.

Immigrants are taking all those good jobs.

http://blogs.voanews.com/all-about-america/2015/08/24/most-common-jobs-held-by-immigrants-in-each-us-state/

most-common-job-held-by-immigrants-in-ea

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Most illegals are not criminals, but those who are have been deported in record numbers.

In other words, more and more illegals coming to the US are criminals than ever before. That is kinda what trump said, Geez, he was correct?

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Because since 2008, more Mexican illegals are leaving the U.S. than entering.

You really think that anyone with a little bit of intelligence is going to believe that? With the latin gang membership growing and the cartel presence increasing? Only a fool would believe that.

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I see that Alex has succeeded in turning this thread into a debate about US immigration policies, and away from the intent of feelings on agreeing with the Mexican position on deportation of illegals, and putting Mexico and its people first compared to illegals. I congratulate you, Alex, you are indeed good at reflecting blame elsewhere and using smoke. Your articles had nothing to do with the original post, as I knew, so I never wasted MY time.

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In other words, more and more illegals coming to the US are criminals than ever before. That is kinda what trump said, Geez, he was correct?

That's not what the Trumpeteer said, is it?

Now, for Joco's post about the good jobs being taken by immigrants, can we revisit the concept of Capitalism ? It is, after all, the prevailing economic principle upon which America was built.

Jobs are given by employers. The employer is motivated by the desire to increase the return on his capital investment. He is not likely to be motivated by charity, patriotism or politics, so I think we can safely assume that a good Capitalist will hire the best qualified employee he can get for the lowest price. It's the cutthroat competition for jobs market, as it has always been.

Take, for example, the competition for jobs in the high tech industry. People from out of the country, facilitated by government legislation, are hired for low wages to do jobs that U.S. citizen programmers and help desk employees used to be paid good money for doing. These foreign workers don't even have to emigrate to the U.S. to get the jobs. As a result, the general wages for the lower tier of U.S. techies are reduced. Capitalism at its finest, si?

So, what's the problem? Can't have it both ways. Slavery was pretty profitable, too, all the way from the ship building industry to the plantations.

Since Mexico is already overloaded with potential workers, they approach the matter of immigration differently, and completely logically, by forbidding immigrants from taking jobs a Mexican citizen can do. Maybe the U.S. could take a page from Mexico's book on that one.

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Does anyone know the location of "The Sanctuary Cities" here in Mexico?? Have a friend who's Visa expired.

Oh, right. I'm sure you do. jejeje.

BTW, I agree with you that "Sanctuary Cities" are not a good idea.

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I see that Alex has succeeded in turning this thread into a debate about US immigration policies, and away from the intent of feelings on agreeing with the Mexican position on deportation of illegals, and putting Mexico and its people first compared to illegals. I congratulate you, Alex, you are indeed good at reflecting blame elsewhere and using smoke. Your articles had nothing to do with the original post, as I knew, so I never wasted MY time.

Don't be silly, Hud...I was just trying to direct the readers here to some factual information about the subject you wish to discuss and away from the biased ideological misinformation you and a few others have been promoting. Once again, I offer you the opportunity to deal with the facts and not the political rhetoric. From the MPI website you refuse to view...

Migrants Deported from the United States and Mexico to the Northern Triangle: A Statistical and Socioeconomic Profile

http://www.migrationpolicy.org/research/migrants-deported-united-states-and-mexico-northern-triangle-statistical-and-socioeconomic

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In other words, more and more illegals coming to the US are criminals than ever before. That is kinda what trump said, Geez, he was correct?

Criminals are first on the deportation list. Students and law abiding illegals are at the end of the list.

Because more criminals are being deported and the Obama Administration has been deporting more illegals than any previous Administration, it stands to reason that in the record number of those being deported, there are more criminals who were skipped over previously who are now included in being deported.

The Mexican illegals in the U.S. have been self-deporting since 2008 because of the job market. Mexican illegals entering is also down. It is estimated that Mexican illegal migration is less than zero.

I doubt Trump was correct about anything.

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Bennie,I am not anti-American in the least.

But I do believe that the extreme right is doing a great disservice to my country.

My apologies to the board if the above violated forum rules but I don't know how else to respond to accusations that I'm "anti-American".

Considering the number of people in this discussion who have vilified the U.S. government, claiming that it has not been protecting its own citizens from immigrants, how is it that you were singled out to be accused of being anti-American? The logic of this escapes me. Oh...now I remember...it's Bennie logic.

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