AlanMexicali Posted June 4, 2015 Report Share Posted June 4, 2015 To the topic. I see the continued flow of expats into Mexico. Not a flood, but I expect it to be real steady. I retired at 56. The requirements were not difficult to meet. The comments on this board that Mexico is now on par with the US are laughable. My Property taxes in Michigan were just slightly higher than my total budget for 2 months here in SMA and I do not live like the poor in the Compos. My electric bill here is 7 times less, even with the convoluted CFE system. The reason that I do not see a "wave" coming is simple. It takes a sense of adventure to leave everything behind. Most people fear the unknown and will not ever even look at expatriation. It is just too far out of their comfort zone. I am good with all of that, as I do not want to see Soccer Mom syndrome come here any faster than it will naturally. As for Ecuador I went there several times and I looked at it very carefully, over all Mexico is just a friendlier easier place to live. President Correa is fairly Socialist, but also very protectionist so imported goods cost far more. Electronics are hugely expensive. Indications are it is going to get worse. As for language I agree with most that it is very hard at this age. I use Doulingo every day and have a large Spanish vocabulary. But I cannot hold a conversation with a native speaker. All of my Mexican friends have far better English and thankfully are very patient with my attempts at Spanish. Good post, Michigander. I especially agree with your comment that expatriation is just too far out of most comfort zones. I reminds me of the time a business associate from the midwest U.S. came to Southern California in winter and couldn't believe the blooming flowers and the mild weather. He said he'd love to move, but his town was "where all my friends are", so the idea of moving west was not thinkable. Moving to Mexico? What a concept. I think you both have the main reasons for retirees not moving to Mexico when they might enjoy it at least part time. Their comfort zone is not here. I feel if about 40% [instead of about 5%] of the Mexican population spoke passable English, like they do in the Philippines, their comfort zone would increase. The point about having an adventurous nature is why many of us are here. We probably like the way we are and don´t feel out of place no matter where we go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lakeside7 Posted June 4, 2015 Report Share Posted June 4, 2015 To the topic. I see the continued flow of expats into Mexico. Not a flood, but I expect it to be real steady. I retired at 56. The requirements were not difficult to meet. The comments on this board that Mexico is now on par with the US are laughable. My Property taxes in Michigan were just slightly higher than my total budget for 2 months here in SMA and I do not live like the poor in the Compos. My electric bill here is 7 times less, even with the convoluted CFE system. The reason that I do not see a "wave" coming is simple. It takes a sense of adventure to leave everything behind. Most people fear the unknown and will not ever even look at expatriation. It is just too far out of their comfort zone. I am good with all of that, as I do not want to see Soccer Mom syndrome come here any faster than it will naturally. As for Ecuador I went there several times and I looked at it very carefully, over all Mexico is just a friendlier easier place to live. President Correa is fairly Socialist, but also very protectionist so imported goods cost far more. Electronics are hugely expensive. Indications are it is going to get worse. As for language I agree with most that it is very hard at this age. I use Doulingo every day and have a large Spanish vocabulary. But I cannot hold a conversation with a native speaker. All of my Mexican friends have far better English and thankfully are very patient with my attempts at Spanish. I can understand if you are from Michigan and were able to sell your house, you have two pluses..looking for a better climate and were able to sell a house in a very depressed market area...a move to Fl, Az, Nv would be a plus to get away from the Mi winters and high home taxes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gringal Posted June 4, 2015 Report Share Posted June 4, 2015 A move to Fl, Az or Nv would oblige one to live with the weather in those places. Ugh. Of course, some folks actually like hotter'nhell summers or high humidity to accompany it. I like the weather right here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Menudo Posted June 4, 2015 Report Share Posted June 4, 2015 The climate here is wonderful. The rest, I have had enough of. Headed back soon. Not saying it isn't right for others, I just want to have lunch at Nordstrom's and live on a smooth paved street with curbs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michigander Posted June 5, 2015 Report Share Posted June 5, 2015 Actually Michigan was coming back nicely when we left and we did well. The main reasons for leaving were high taxes/regulation and the weather. My wife sold her business and did not want to start over, so I turned my business over to my kids and we left. We had been looking to retire off shore for years (been to Chapala twice) Fell in love with SMA and never looked back. I understand the desire for smooth paved streets I swear the cobbles in my neighborhood are getting worse after a couple hundred years, (never had lunch at Nordstrom's) but for me the question is "at what cost". I always loved the reaction of friends and family when we were telling them about the move. Ranged from horror, to are you crazy. That is why I believe there will not be the Wave of expats. Most people still think of Mexico as a Clint Eastwood movie (made in Italy). You need a sense of adventure to drag up your life and move to the unknown. Your average US senior simply does not have that. So I wish them good health and hot humid weather in FL, AZ, NM, and where ever else they congregate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mainecoons Posted June 5, 2015 Author Report Share Posted June 5, 2015 The climate here is wonderful. The rest, I have had enough of. Headed back soon. Not saying it isn't right for others, I just want to have lunch at Nordstrom's and live on a smooth paved street with curbs. This place isn't tidy or well maintained, particularly in the last 4 years or so. It seems the Chapala Municipal government has not only managed to disappear a whole lot of money with little to show for it, it now shares the dubious distinction with only 12 other municipalities in the state of Jalisco of owing so much money that it spends more on debt service than it does on services. Hence we've had an explosion of pot holed streets and roads and a lot more trash on them. This despite having a relatively rich tax base and having jacked up local taxes quite substantially. It's a good thing there are many, many other things that make it great to live here of which the incredible climate is only one. I think you've made a good point that supports the belief that there isn't about to be a flood of retirees coming to Mexico in general or here in particular. This place is really not for everyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CHILLIN Posted June 5, 2015 Report Share Posted June 5, 2015 A point about climate. I know B.C. and Alberta well, and I don't know if you realize there has been major growth in senior living complexes and leisure centers. It is the same in Western Europe. The facilities can range from basic, government subsidized, up to ultra deluxe - sort of like a cruise ship docked on land. Many of the public leisure centers are very large, including a variety of pools, gyms, restaurants, steam/sauna, as well as a lot of classes, public interest speakers, crafts, and clubs. These leisure centers are all heavily subsidized for seniors. So the point is, even in Edmonton Alberta, in a snowstorm, it is quite comfortable in your swimsuit at the pool, or socializing in the senior living centers. If the season means you can't get outside for a walk in the gardens, then there are a variety of walking clubs at local shopping malls. I know, many will say it would be like living in a space colony, but the fact of the matter than many people get used to this lifestyle very quickly. A two week holiday once or twice a year is quite enough for this large and growing crowd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ComputerGuy Posted June 5, 2015 Report Share Posted June 5, 2015 For me, having lived all across the country while growing up, but eventually settling in Ottawa, it isn't about the places I can go to in bad weather. It's about getting there in bad weather. Winter weather is 24 hours a day, and results in cabin fever pretty quickly. You are constantly bombarded with cold and snow and sleet and dark grey skies. The occasional sunny, sparkling winter day in no way makes up for the knowledge that even the most simple of efforts requires boots, mitts, hats, parkas, windshield scrapers, block heaters, ice, lunatic drivers, steamed car windows, or stinky hot buses. And then when you get there, you can only hope they have plugs for your block heater, too... (And the fact that the weather even in the summer is so entirely predictable that making plans for an outdoor picnic or BBQ is almost a joke.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gringal Posted June 5, 2015 Report Share Posted June 5, 2015 Reality check: You can pick your friends, your hobbies, your home decor and many other things almost anywhere. The one thing you have to live with 24/7/365 is the climate, although as someone mentioned, there are "space bubble" facilities for those who desire them. Personally, I'd go bananas if I couldn't get out and about, see some wildlife and kids running around. However, these cobblestoned, potholed streets are truly the pitts and my opinion of whoever let this happen is lower than a cockroach's belly.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ComputerGuy Posted June 5, 2015 Report Share Posted June 5, 2015 And for those who can't leave their less-than-pleasant climate, at least there are more options now than ever before. One place I know of back home actually has a petting garden, where all kinds of little goats and bunnies and etc. frolic around, near a man-made babbling rock-stream (for those summer months at your seniors' home, anyway). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mainecoons Posted June 5, 2015 Author Report Share Posted June 5, 2015 The climate is the absolute biggie for us and as a motorcycle rider, there's a big additional benefit for me in the form of great riding year round. Plus we live with windows open and fresh breezes also nearly year round. When we visit our relatives in north Texas, almost all the time you are living in a closed up space with what feels like stale air to us. Year round, we have greenery and blooms in our garden as well. This place really does have incredible weather. Those trips to Texas are excellent reminders of what a far more extreme climate feels like. It feels like we'd whole lot rather be here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RickS Posted June 5, 2015 Report Share Posted June 5, 2015 "Most people think of Mexico as a Clint Eastwood movie...." Oh, if it were only so. My experience living here NOB (Colorado, but with travels elsewhere) is that most people think of Mexico as "a place they wouldn't go to anymore, much less live there". Acquaintances of mine won't even think of going to even Cancun or PV anymore. You should see the look of horror in their eyes when we say we are again headed to Mexico for a while! Their memory of the pictures of the lawlessness and beheadings gives them the willies and it is not something they can dismiss. And, of course, the State Department keeps it alive with their (well-meaning?) travel alerts. Just my experience.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slainte39 Posted June 5, 2015 Report Share Posted June 5, 2015 Then why is Mexico increasing in tourists and tourist "dollars" spent? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Menudo Posted June 5, 2015 Report Share Posted June 5, 2015 Then why is Mexico increasing in tourists and tourist "dollars" spent? Who said it was? Most of the cruise ships have even stopped coming to PV. And look at Alcapulco. Nobody goes there anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mainecoons Posted June 6, 2015 Author Report Share Posted June 6, 2015 It is but if I understand the limited data on this, the increase is coming in the short term vacationer visitors, namely go to over-priced gringoized resorts like Cancun and PV, spend a couple of weeks and a lot of money and go home. Personally, I think that is what Mexico really wants to push. I don't think they are keen on folks like us who basically come here to live. That's my opinion, I can't really back it up. To do so would require some data on the number of Temporary Resident and Permanent Resident permits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Bowie Posted June 6, 2015 Report Share Posted June 6, 2015 The climate is the absolute biggie for us and as a motorcycle rider, there's a big additional benefit for me in the form of great riding year round. Plus we live with windows open and fresh breezes also nearly year round. When we visit our relatives in north Texas, almost all the time you are living in a closed up space with what feels like stale air to us. Year round, we have greenery and blooms in our garden as well. This place really does have incredible weather. Those trips to Texas are excellent reminders of what a far more extreme climate feels like. It feels like we'd whole lot rather be here. If that is your experience, then I am going to suggest that you do not pick the dates of your NOB visits very well, and maybe not your destination. We experience all the same things you experience here(that you like, and none of those you dislike) on our trips NOB, plus a whole lot more that is not offered here at Lakeside. Many here have not spent quality time NOB in a long time, and lots has changed for the best. We do pick our times( both here and NOB) and have the BEST of both Worlds. We give up very little, as a result. That is our experience, but I am not trying to convince anyone here to change their habits. Everyone should do what makes them comfortable and happy, if possible. We do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michigander Posted June 6, 2015 Report Share Posted June 6, 2015 Who said it was? Most of the cruise ships have even stopped coming to PV. And look at Alcapulco. Nobody goes there anymore. 2014 was a record year for International tourist in Mexico. 14.2 million visitors. Alcapulco is still way down but most of Mexico is doing very well with visitors. http://www.journeymexico.com/blog/mexico-tourism-facts-statistics-2014 With the building of the new Cruise Ship port at Rocky Point it is likely to even grow more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Semalu Posted June 6, 2015 Report Share Posted June 6, 2015 The link doesn't seem to work. Nevertheless, after a direct experiences with tourism stats in Mexico I have developed a deep suspicion of them. Two examples come to mind, several trips to Acapulco while on business, and where the most recent stat said 98%occupancy...yet it was obvious the place was empty. The same thing happened in PVR yet the streets were empty. Seems to me the Stats are used to create an illusion that "everything is just fine"instead of being based on anything like reality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tycobb1020 Posted June 6, 2015 Report Share Posted June 6, 2015 Ah, the Tourism Conspiracy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mainecoons Posted June 6, 2015 Author Report Share Posted June 6, 2015 MEXICO CITY — Sunbathers stretch out along white beach after white beach on the sweltering Caribbean coast. Tequila-swigging revelers pack the glittering nightclubs wall to wall. Surfers carve up the Pacific waves.Yup, that sounds like Mexico all right — but it’s actually been a summer like no other. As the season draws to an end, officials here are boasting a bumper season in the country’s top resorts, including Puerto Vallarta, Los Cabos and Cancun, where hotels have been packed to the highest levels ever. The total number of tourists in Mexico hit a record in the first half of the year, with more than 14 million foreigners touching down, almost 20 percent more compared to last year, the Tourism Department said. The spike in visitors, especially Americans, comes after several years of stagnation in the travel sector here amid a slow global economic recovery and fears of gory cartel violence. The arrivals first dropped in 2009, when cartel killings rocketed and an H1N1 flu scare swept the country. Tourists continued to arrive in fewer numbers from 2010 to 2012, as mass graves and gang massacres tarnished Mexico’s name. Last year, tourist numbers finally recovered to just over the 2008 level. This year they soared. The return of visitors follows an ad campaign, including images of Mexico’s crystalline waters, curving coastlines and Aztec pyramids behind soothing music and this play-on-cliche slogan: “Live it to believe it.” http://www.nbcnews.com/news/latino/summer-no-other-mexico-tourism-hits-record-levels-n193706 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slainte39 Posted June 6, 2015 Report Share Posted June 6, 2015 Who said it was? Most of the cruise ships have even stopped coming to PV. And look at Alcapulco. Nobody goes there anymore. Don't know about right now , but what I do know is anecdotal after spending two weeks on the Bahia de Banderas (Nuevo Vallarta) in March. All the hotels were busy, restaurants full to packed, cruise ships coming and going daily from the Marina, and from our vantage point in the Mayan Village of the airport, airplanes arriving and leaving every 15 minutes, and I'm sure they weren't empty. Bucerias and Sayulita, were wall to wall tourists to the point where it was hard to drive, park, or even walk. Heard recently that Bill Gates is making a big investment on Punta Mita, and he is not known for backing losers. You would have a hard time convincing me that they were "cooking the books", at least in the PV area. Usually the loudest whining is done by the industry when there's a dearth of business. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mainecoons Posted June 7, 2015 Author Report Share Posted June 7, 2015 Same experience when we went to PV a few months ago. The place was packed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michigander Posted June 7, 2015 Report Share Posted June 7, 2015 I am always suspect of Government numbers, but you can only lie so big. I know that tourism and travel are up because multiple sources report it. Anecdotal evidence also supports it. While in the Yucatan last year everything seemed very busy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
traderspoc Posted June 16, 2015 Report Share Posted June 16, 2015 your statistics is not correct 93 million unemployed, you must have counted kids and spouses. there are only about 121.9 million people full time working in US out of a population of 320 million. This statistic shows the unadjusted number of full-time employees in the United States. In line with the definition of the BLS, full-time workers are persons who usually work 35 hours or more per week. In May 2015, about 121.9 million people were employed on a full-time basis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bennie2 Posted June 17, 2015 Report Share Posted June 17, 2015 there are now massive firing of tech pros. some have been there for 20-30years. they have to train the new help coming from overseas. if they dont, they lose their comp package. the new people are working for 1/2 salary. disney is just one of the comps. everyday there is more unemployment. between outsourcing & the new guest work visas, growing problem. dont forget all the college grads w/useless liberal arts degrees. guess they have starbucks to fall back on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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