gringal Posted July 23, 2014 Report Share Posted July 23, 2014 I'm no where near fluent and I'm happy. What jrm said. A good attitude and a little Spanglish goes a long way here. Fluency is nothing to get all excited about, one way or the other. Learning to speak any language well depends on any number of things: age, hearing ability, and the amount of exposure to native speakers on a daily basis. I had to chuckle at the comment that lack of fluency avoids some boring conversations. So does going deaf. After reading more posts, I can only conclude that if there are unhappy people reading this and/or sending private PM's to tell about it must be either (1) too broke to make it back to wherever "home" is or (2) just like to complain and probably weren't all that happy at any time. I have sympathy for the first group. Flexible people; people who can handle change ....are usually the happiest. Talking about "The Good Old Days" , whether here or wherever, just doesn't pass the logic bar: Life IS change. In our bodies, in our environment, and hopefully, in our attitudes. The Good Old Days were also the Bad Old Days, in many ways. A century ago, people died and were crippled without modern drugs. In Mexico, there was greater poverty than today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Betsy Posted July 23, 2014 Report Share Posted July 23, 2014 For some people, living in Mexico is like being in a relationship. After a while, the things that drew them in and charmed them begin to annoy and grate until they just want out. For others, it is a life-long love affair.Well isn't that the truth. Mexico, like my husband, has some annoying traits and some of them get on my last nerve... but I still love both of them and no imperfection can affect my happiness. Some people even have this wierd reverence for Mexico and expect everyone else to have it too. If you don't they are quick to tell you that you should just pack your chit and go because whatever goes wrong is your fault anyway. If that rude guy at immigration snaps your head off its because you didn't inquire about his day in Spanish because they just LOVE that even if they speak English well. If you even think about discussing anything negative you should remember that you are a "guest" in Mexico. Should you be alarmed about a murder, kidnapping , shootout or whatever in your neighborhood you are obviously not aware of the crime rate in Detroit. I don't understand why some people need to put Mexico on a pedestal, it's almost as if they have propped themselves up there too and if Mexico doesn't measure up then neither do they. It seems like a superficial relationship to me. These people will probably never know the joy of chasing that kid who just kicked your geriatric dog up the street while screaming insults and waving a large stick with their neighbors cheering them on. Not that I have ever done anything like that either (haha ), I'm just sayin it's better when you keep it real. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gringal Posted July 23, 2014 Report Share Posted July 23, 2014 Right on target, Betsy. Nowhere, deserves a steenkeeng pedestal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LaChula Posted July 23, 2014 Report Share Posted July 23, 2014 La Chula: literal translation of BFE is Bum F*** Egypt, another way of saying "the boonies." I NEVER heard that expression. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Travis Posted July 23, 2014 Report Share Posted July 23, 2014 I agree. Great and refreshing post, Betsy. On the language topic. I think it depends on the individual. I agree that it's not necessary to speak Spanish to survive and even live happily here, at least not in Ajijic. There are lots of people who are content without it. But I wouldn't be. In six years here, I've worked fairly diligently - in a lazy way - at learning the language. I am by no means fluent. But without the effort I've made, I know I personally would be frustrated on a regular basis just trying to go about my day-to-day business. If I was limited to English-only exchanges, I would be bored out of my mind. And.... I'd be much less happy here. Much. So I don't think it's fair to say "fluency is nothing to get all excited about, one way or the other". I think it depends on the individual. What their needs and desires are, and how they want to experience life here. But that's just me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joco Posted July 23, 2014 Report Share Posted July 23, 2014 It is interesting that some that post as happy are now giving us the reasons for others that are not happy. Mexico has a lot of plusses, but those plusses do not outweigh the negatives for some people. For others, they do. You cannot base your life here on others feelings about things, only yours. Most people that live here are happy they are here, for LOTS of reasons; some the same, others different. To be true to yourself, I think it wise to hear the good and the ugly of Mexico, and certainly experience quality time here before you make that "life long" commitment. Some people have reasons to move back home that are beyond their control like health and family. Moving to another country can be romantic and thrilling for a few years and then the newness wears off just like dating. Anything can get old and boring after awhile. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bennie2 Posted July 23, 2014 Report Share Posted July 23, 2014 betsy, the mentality you speak of has nothing to do w/mexico. its how smallminded people think. they would be the same no matter where they were. if you didnt like sloppy joes diner in alabama (or the mall in tulca), then you dont know sxxt. because nothing exists outside of themselves. they havnt traveled much, this is the biggest most important event in their life: red sea has parted. they may have taken some "tours" when package deals were introduced, & airfares were cut. since they felt marginalized in the US, they can feel important here. the other group are the old trotskyites, they are forever in the peacecore. or they wanted to be a realhippy. coming to mexico is worshipping/patronizing the culture or doing social work. they also dont see anything else except themselves. most look the same to me visually. they too are walking thru mecca w/a backpack, collection cup in hand. 1st & 2nd group are similar. they seem to thrive on difficulties. the 3rd group is retired, live in developements pay golf, cards, dont have much of an agenda. their maid is not "part of the family". they are kind of beign like elevator music. somehow they do "keep it real". you may think they are boring, i find them low maintance as they are the least confrontational. most folks in these 3 groups are naive. there are some interesting folks, yes you may find them on this forum. as for speaking spanish, a few words can help. sometimes its best not the understand everyones jabber. you have your privacy that way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joco Posted July 23, 2014 Report Share Posted July 23, 2014 I had to chuckle at the comment that lack of fluency avoids some boring conversations. So does going deaf. Seriously, you never pretended you are deaf to get out of a conversation? Just look at the person and make up some sign language. They will go away. Hint, you can't switch to deaf in the middle of a conversation. I know I've tried. They catch on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bennie2 Posted July 24, 2014 Report Share Posted July 24, 2014 the sales pitches have grown tired. other wize this would have been deleted yesterday. the new market is mexicans from guad. now wasnt THAT easy?? you like it you buy it. you dont, tell us your needs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gringal Posted July 24, 2014 Report Share Posted July 24, 2014 Seriously, you never pretended you are deaf to get out of a conversation? Just look at the person and make up some sign language. They will go away. Hint, you can't switch to deaf in the middle of a conversation. I know I've tried. They catch on That is truly pathetic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
valbogyo Posted July 24, 2014 Report Share Posted July 24, 2014 I am feeling more at home now. It will be three years, this Dec, that I own my house. I have spent quite a bit of money just getting comfortable. I finally brought a few of my favorite paintings down, and as I hang them.... I really feel like I could live here for a long time. For me, as a single woman, the gated community works out. I have really enjoyed getting to know my neighbors. Everyone has a story to tell, and it ends up they we have a group that gets along. It is becoming more integrated, with Mexicans investing in homes. As long I avoid condo politics (found anywhere in the world where there is a condo). I am very happy. I feel it took me two years to really meet a group of individuals that have similar interests and values. I find myself going further out of the lakeside area for adventures. When I feel I have island fever, hanging around the Chapala municipality, I go beyond. Grab a friend and explore all the beautiful valleys and communities near by. So. No regrets, at this time. I love Canada, but the weather sucks most of the year. I would only return if I had to for Medical issues, just to be near my support system. On the other hand... I feel I am developing one here. That has a lot to do with longevity in feeling satisfied here. I know several people who just could not find a group of friends here. They were unhappy and left. Without a few good friends, or enough money.... it is difficult to be happy here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mainecoons Posted July 24, 2014 Report Share Posted July 24, 2014 I wonder how many of the people who are so happy here are not fluent in Spanish? Not fluent in Spanish. Have studied for years but just can't quite get a grasp on hearing the language. Having a severe hearing problem doesn't help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monessen Posted July 24, 2014 Report Share Posted July 24, 2014 bennie2 It's kind of late in the conversation to explain my comment about the friends who moved back to the U.S. who didn't like Mexican food but I have to say I was nonplussed by it as well. I think that it was just a subconscious way for them to express their fear of making a mistake in their lives. Food is so important psychologically as well as physically (everyone knows that, Monessen!) and I concluded that they were mentally preparing to leave even as they arrived in Mexico. Sometimes I encounter Mexicans who think that gringos do not want to learn Spanish. I tell them that, in fact, lots of money, time and aggravation are spent by many, many gringos trying to learn the language. Now that I spend time with my Mexican friends from Guad and locally I hear them shortening words, using slang that I either do not want to learn (bad language) or that are saying things that at first don't make sense (ocupar for necesitar, for example) I realize how truly difficult becoming fluent in Spanish is. It's easy when you grow up with it. I'm sure that many gringos "will die" still trying to learn the language. I see that as a positive--no matter where you are personally on the Spanish language scale. One of my Mexican friends was ending a phone conversation the other day and for the first time I realized that he was saying good-bye but in such a truncated way that I never got it before! Learning Spanish here is difficult. If you can't seem to grasp it that's ok. My Mexican friends experience the same type of problems when they listen to gringos speak. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
puro guero Posted July 24, 2014 Report Share Posted July 24, 2014 Occasionally, those who have left lakeside for other destinations post a followup which can provide some insight into why people might prefer one location over another, On another thread (low altitude with a great climate) member DVD123 wrote: "My wife and I lived in the Chapala Area for 8 1/2 years and the last 2 years of that time my wife and I just got bored living there. We live in Orange County 8 miles from the beach and the weather is so much better than Chapala.We live close to a very large church and love it. Disneyland is only 8 miles away and we have annual passes so we are there a lot. We have Dish Network and love Hallmark movies. We have lots of shopping within 2 miles of where we live." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xena Posted July 24, 2014 Report Share Posted July 24, 2014 Speaking of boring: megachurch, Disneyland, shopping and Hallmark movies. That sounds like my idea of hell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rogerm Posted July 24, 2014 Report Share Posted July 24, 2014 Xena one mans trash is another mans treasure. All depends on how big or how Small you see things????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gringal Posted July 24, 2014 Report Share Posted July 24, 2014 Each person should have the right to live in their own happiness without being put down for it, no? Absolutely. And I'll have to say, their preferences fit nicely together, like when Netflix suggests that if you like a certain movie, there are other things you'd probably like as well. If your pleasure in life is having lots of passive entertainment: (i.e. the post about the people who moved to Orange County,) rather than active participation, you would be bored here and would be much more satisfied with a place that provides it. The happiest people I've met here are very involved in the arts, sports, charity work, and anything else they can put their hands and minds to. These are the things potential expats need to think about before moving here. What's your pleasure? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xena Posted July 24, 2014 Report Share Posted July 24, 2014 "Each person should have the right to live in their own happiness without being put down for it, no?" Yeeeesssss. How is my saying that their version of a happy life is not mine "putting them down"? I made no judgement on them. Just as they expressed that living where I live was "boring" to them, I said living where they moved would be hell to me. I did not feel they were putting me down by being bored here. They were just talking about their own experience--just as I was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rogerm Posted July 24, 2014 Report Share Posted July 24, 2014 Now That is pathetic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bennie2 Posted July 25, 2014 Report Share Posted July 25, 2014 monessen, about the friends who "dont like mexican food" youre correct, it was a rationalization. so much of the food here is just regular food. as for learning spanish thats up to the person. part of the sales pitch was that you didnt have to learn it. (rightly so). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gringal Posted July 26, 2014 Report Share Posted July 26, 2014 Now That is pathetic That phrase is copyrighted. Maybe you should try prunes. Usually helps after a few hours. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbviajero Posted July 26, 2014 Report Share Posted July 26, 2014 I think not speaking Spanish fluently is a plus. It cuts down on boring conversations. I disagree,I have interesting conversations with Mexicans all the time, Expats who can't speak the language of the country they're living in are missing a lot,but I understand how difficult it is at an advanced age to learn a new language. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bennie2 Posted July 26, 2014 Report Share Posted July 26, 2014 sometimes it's difficult @ any age. needed a private tutor to pass language in school. if you want interesting conversations you need to be on a high level of the language. lets face it, mexico became the alternative to living in florida. (dont say its pathetic). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joco Posted July 26, 2014 Report Share Posted July 26, 2014 I disagree,I have interesting conversations with Mexicans all the time, Expats who can't speak the language of the country they're living in are missing a lot,but I understand how difficult it is at an advanced age to learn a new language. "That's a joke, son. A flag waver. You're built too low. The fast ones go over your head. Ya got a hole in your glove. I keep pitchin' 'em and you keep missin' 'em. Ya gotta keep your eye on the ball. Eye. Ball. I almost had a gag, son. Joke, that is." Foghorn Leghorn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mainecoons Posted July 26, 2014 Report Share Posted July 26, 2014 Absolutely. And I'll have to say, their preferences fit nicely together, like when Netflix suggests that if you like a certain movie, there are other things you'd probably like as well. If your pleasure in life is having lots of passive entertainment: (i.e. the post about the people who moved to Orange County,) rather than active participation, you would be bored here and would be much more satisfied with a place that provides it. The happiest people I've met here are very involved in the arts, sports, charity work, and anything else they can put their hands and minds to. These are the things potential expats need to think about before moving here. What's your pleasure? I can't imagine or even grasp the concept of being bored here. I have no problem experiencing it when we visit the in laws in Texas for extended periods. Watching TV seems to be the main activity up there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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