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Army in Ajijic and manning the Pillboxes going toward Joco


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bigd, you ask a good question. there has been a great increase of military/state police here i the last 7 yrs. the "tough guy" act is an americana thing, from the pioneer days, it seems to be a trait of midwesterners, texans, n.w. americans. personally am a sissy, im scared to even visit arizonia. the border is one place i would consider like an alien jungle. if there are addtional radical islamic incidents, we will see more national guard in the USA, especially n.east coast. (like they had after 9/11). the USA is a tremendous country, different kind of crimes occur in different sections. it is not normal for me to see military in my home towns. police are outside of public schools, in really dangerous areas only. ps i AM happy to see armed guards outside of palacio de hierro mall in zapapan.

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bigd, you ask a good question. there has been a great increase of military/state police here i the last 7 yrs. the "tough guy" act is an americana thing, from the pioneer days, it seems to be a trait of midwesterners, texans, n.w. americans. personally am a sissy, im scared to even visit arizonia. the border is one place i would consider like an alien jungle. if there are more radical islamic threat incidents, we will see more national guard in the USA, especially n.east coast. (like they had after 9/11). the USA is a tremendous country, different kind of crimes occur in different sections. it is not normal for me to see military in my home towns. police are outside of public schools, in really dangerous areas only. ps i AM happy to see armed guards outside of palacio de hierro mall in zapapan.

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My point is, why would a person want to consider a place to retire where it takes the military to protect them? There is crime in most places where people live. A little disturbing to find armed military in the street. This not 1960 but 2013 people choose this place to retire for different reasons I have lived in Mexico since 1994 I have never felt good about seeing armed military where private citizens go. It doesn't mean you are tough or super rugged because you tolorate these things.

Emphasis: "I have never felt good about seeing armed military where private citizens go."

I agree and feel the same. The fact that weapons in Mexico are routinely brandished is an overt display of power and aggression. Not to mention there are grey areas around these authorities as to who are the good/bad guys.

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I wonder how you would feel if you saw an M-60 military Tank roll into the Kroger parking lot while you were picking up a loaf of bread in the United States? No big deal glad to have them?

Crossing the Canadian/US border you get to look at guns pointed at you, further down the road you get more of the same, and we Canadians are really not enemies of the US!

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Crossing the Canadian/US border you get to look at guns pointed at you, further down the road you get more of the same, and we Canadians are really not enemies of the US!

That is a strange statement. Since 1999, I have crossed about every 3 months, going or coming. I cross at Laredo, and have NEVER had a gun pointed at me, or in my direction. I take HWY 35N to San Antonio, and at the checkpoint about 40 miles out, NEVER had a gun pointed at me or in my direction. One would think that the southern border was the major concern, no? I, too, satnrose, have always felt uneasy to see so many armed military/police in civilian areas. If you live here, of course, you have accepted it, but still feel uneasy. Never experienced that before. And, lots of GREY areas !

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I know of many places in the U.S. that could use military check points to reduce crime. My home town is a perfect example. Shootings every day, home invasions, burglaries, drug dealing, etc.. They recently spent millions of dollars installing gun fire detection systems throughout the city to determine where gunshots were coming from. Yes, there are that many every day. Police are overwhelmed with work, and there is no money available to hire more or to help with equipment. The city has changed considerably within the last ten years. I feel sorry for those folks and especially my 70 year old parents that refuse to leave such a violent place.

Would I feel comfortable if they decided to place a military check point somewhere in the city? ABSOLUTELY!! Just like I feel perfectly fine when I drive by Ajijic. These guys are not so stupid as to have a finger on the trigger, safety off, and round in the chamber, and sneeze!! They have protocol, and even though they have quick access to live ammo, I think you would be surprised to know that their weapons are not live. But can be within a second or two.

I feel safe here and have no issues with what the Mexican government is doing. They are trying to make things safe and get ahead of more problems that may come. They are trying. I don't think they want to see a mass-exodus of gringos heading back North.

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My point is, why would a person want to consider a place to retire where it takes the military to protect them? There is crime in most places where people live. A little disturbing to find armed military in the street. This not 1960 but 2013 people choose this place to retire for different reasons I have lived in Mexico since 1994 I have never felt good about seeing armed military where private citizens go. It doesn't mean you are tough or super rugged because you tolorate these things.

Spot on.

The presence of military does not look good to newly retired folks checking out this area as a place to live. I've lived in Mexico and other 3rd world countries and understand that a military presence is a necessary evil. But don't kid yourselves, it's not a positive image for visitors or potential newcomers.

Despite what others have falsely posted, armed military checkpoints do not exist in and around small lakeside communities in the US.

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Spot on.

The presence of military does not look good to newly retired folks checking out this area as a place to live. I've lived in Mexico and other 3rd world countries and understand that a military presence is a necessary evil. But don't kid yourselves, it's not a positive image for visitors or potential newcomers.

Despite what others have falsely posted, armed military checkpoints do not exist in and around small lakeside communities in the US.

Mexico is NOT a third world country. It is a developing nation. No one cares who likes what, the Governor sent the State Police and I believe the Army too. They cannot afford to have Gringos leave, otherwise mass unemployment.

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Mexico is NOT a third world country. It is a developing nation. No one cares who likes what, the Governor sent the State Police and I believe the Army too. They cannot afford to have Gringos leave, otherwise mass unemployment.

Maybe like you Gringos are leaving for "other personal reasons" Never know why someone leaves Mexico?

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Mexico is NOT a third world country. It is a developing nation. No one cares who likes what, the Governor sent the State Police and I believe the Army too. They cannot afford to have Gringos leave, otherwise mass unemployment.

Then maybe they better get serious about looking at all the INM/Aduana chaos they've dumped on the expat community since the first of the year because, right now, it sure looks like they don't care about it much.

Just sayin. . .

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the govt doesnt care about employment in ajijic, or small businesses, or your safety. a community of elderly expats is not a priority for the state of jalisco. i am a realist & a rationist. what they DO care about is having as many box stores& developements built as possible. the writting was on the walls in 2003, took off in 2005.

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While we foreigners are not as important as some think, we do spend quite a bit more than the average citizen. That cash flow is important to the government and they do value it. We apparently have a new administration in Guadalajara that wants to protect that cash flow / value. The governor has made statements supporting that.

The federal actions acknowledge and address the drains that foreigners have put on the economic system, i.e. foreign cars vs domestic, demand for free or low cost governmental medical services/ prescriptions via INMS and seguro popular, tax evasion of capital gains and rents and discounts meant for poor elderly mexicans.

Lets face it there are those who want to take as much as they can and give as little as possible. They would be unwelcome anywhere!

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Yesterday I left the American Legion in Chapala and after walking about a block came to a truckload of Army personnel (dressed like army anyway, although their trucks had sirens which seemed odd). Anyway, they had pulled over a red pickup and were going through it and questioning the owner. As I continued to talk past, another truck-full arrived, siren on (light, no sound). They seemed friendly to me. Not sure what the situation was. Usually just see them on the main drag. I certainly didn't feel unsafe in any way however. I don't mind them at all. A strong legal presence is always a good thing imo, and they've always struck me as friendly, smiling and waving back when I wave hello and give them a friendly beunos tardes.

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chrisb, expats put 100 fold into the ecomony than they take out. few ever use their IMSS, they pay in for an emergency. often will do thefollowup care w/a private dr. so there is much cash going into imss. as for the public hospital i know only one person who used it, same w/imss on a regular basis. the drain on the system is the ovious. but guess what, state police/army have little to do you & me. they have bigger fish to fry. ajijicis4me: "developing" means not developed YET.

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chrisb, expats put 100 fold into the ecomony than they take out. few ever use their IMSS, they pay in for an emergency. often will do thefollowup care w/a private dr. so there is much cash going into imss. as for the public hospital i know only one person who used it, same w/imss on a regular basis. the drain on the system is the ovious. but guess what, state police/army have little to do you & me. they have bigger fish to fry. ajijicis4me: "developing" means not developed YET.

I wished you would be clearer as I have no idea of what you're talking about. Can you explain?

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Then maybe they better get serious about looking at all the INM/Aduana chaos they've dumped on the expat community since the first of the year because, right now, it sure looks like they don't care about it much.

Just sayin. . .

Yep, they shot themselves in the foot one more time and if they keep it up, there will be mass unemploymet, all contractors will go back to being gardeners (and for whom?) and fishermen. Then families will have to move out of rented houses to tarpaper shacks.

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bennie, you think so? Then why the federal/national steps??? I know many who have used IMSS and many more rely on them for meds. You think meds are free? Foreigners use many more than Mexicans.

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While we foreigners are not as important as some think, we do spend quite a bit more than the average citizen. That cash flow is important to the government and they do value it. We apparently have a new administration in Guadalajara that wants to protect that cash flow / value. The governor has made statements supporting that.

The federal actions acknowledge and address the drains that foreigners have put on the economic system, i.e. foreign cars vs domestic, demand for free or low cost governmental medical services/ prescriptions via INMS and seguro popular, tax evasion of capital gains and rents and discounts meant for poor elderly mexicans.

Lets face it there are those who want to take as much as they can and give as little as possible. They would be unwelcome anywhere!

We spend a LOT more than the average citizen. The Gringos support the Lakeside towns. Do you think that Mexicans are spending 20,000 - 40,000 pesos A MONTH as their budget? I know people whose budget is around 40,000 pesos a month, that's alot. Our budget is about 32,000 a month.

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The army is scary at their pillory box. The guy inside stands there with his automatic machine gun pointed at the traffic driving west. If he should cough or sneeze there will be many dead bodies sitting in cars.

You need to go talk to them. They were outside of my house north of the Plaza in Ajijic walking down the street. They are polite and well

trained. Wave to them as you pass them at there station on the carraterra they will wave back. I have seen at least nine or ten different

flavors of cops and military as I travel around the country and only found one fed cop in north of Tepic who was rude. Big deal considering

the danger he is in at that location. No not brave just realistic. Not so safe in my old home NOB anymore with meth. I stay here and smile

at the soldiers.

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Please please...... some of you..... stop assuming, try to take off your NOB glasses and be more critical. This is not a Cleveland primary school.

- Even more so here than anywhere else in the world, do not just believe everything politicians or police tell you (they have a HORRIBLE track record)

- You are not watching a cowboy and indian movie, with the good against the bad.... as someone else stated.... A LOT of gray area here (even one high Jalisco government official confirmed it in the press, yesterday). The good guys are often also bad guys (because they are forced to). There have been so MANY examples of that, even here at Lakeside (do some of you ever leave the house ? ).

- And do not overestimate our importance here, in any way,.... or assuming that we are high on a political agenda. Even if we all (about 5000 people year around, on a population of about 100 000 for the whole lakeside area) have to leave, people will survive (they did so many centuries) and who knows, it might even be a blessing (that is a very different subject). A lot of people here can be absorbed by the Guadalajara area (talking about jobs) with 4 million inhabitants.

- Again : you do not know why reinforcements are here and only choose to believe what makes you feel good, and that is ok, but realize that your conception of things might be very far from the truth.

- And when are we finally going to stop this ridiculous, useless and simplistic comparison with NOB crime ?? Do we really need to find a winner (with most crime) , come on, people.... (retorical question).

- The presence of the army here..... maybe it is good,..... but it could also be a bad sign,.... who knows, but I am not part of the "huray parade" yet. And as Bennie said,... most likely, it has nothing to do with us. So, I am neutral for the time being (difficult postition he, for you, mostly black and white thinkers ?? ). You might want to be wait a while before starting another collection.

Human beings have a strong urge to qualify things (like "good against bad ", labeling the way we are taught to, or .... they are here to protect us....) and put a sticker on everything. Without that, a lot of people feel lost and in a more complicated world (or a world you do not understand) more people need to do that.

Part of understanding (and it makes it more interesting) this culture means that you have to learn that is does not work like that here. Many examples : today a government official will want something from you, but tomorrow is another day, with a different official, and a different document might be needed.

Listen..... believe whatever you want to believe. I can only hope that more readers of this forum will be a little more critical and do some better homework. But more importantly, stop assuming. The only thing that I assume is, that everything is possible here and that Elvis Presley really is dead (or maybe he is here at Lakeside?). Never a dull moment.

Rony

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El belgicano make sense, but few will take his warnings to heart. This place and what is happening here is so different from any experience most of you could ever imagine and has nothing to do with NOB comparisons, yet many always compare it. Most of you do not know anything about Mexico, its political and social history and "the way things are done here". If you did know, you would not believe it was true. The army/police have histories, and most of you prefer to close your eyes and ears to it. Things don't change overnight in Mexico, and not over our lifetime either.

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I frankly get a little tired of being told constantly how stupid I am. Because I choose not to get extremely excited because the military is posted between Ajijic and SJC, because I didn't already nationalize my car, because I don't necessarily follow everyone's advice about security, I'm stupid. We have all chosen to live here and take the good with the bad. I adore it here. I choose not to own a house, partially because I'm tired of being a homeowner, and partially because I like the freedom of not being tied down. I like to read the web board but am starting to doubt my sanity in that regard. Maybe I really AM stupid.

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I frankly get a little tired of being told constantly how stupid I am. Because I choose not to get extremely excited because the military is posted between Ajijic and SJC, because I didn't already nationalize my car, because I don't necessarily follow everyone's advice about security, I'm stupid. We have all chosen to live here and take the good with the bad. I adore it here. I choose not to own a house, partially because I'm tired of being a homeowner, and partially because I like the freedom of not being tied down. I like to read the web board but am starting to doubt my sanity in that regard. Maybe I really AM stupid.

I think I'll just copy, print and cut this post and tape it to my computer.

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