The New Car Rules--Not Good News

[Mainecoons]

Just got this:

http://solmexiconews.com/INM Customs Feb 13th questions PDF.pdf

Cars are covered in the second section, under "Customs."

Here's the bad news:

I just renewed my FM3 for 3 more years. What do I need to do to keep my truck here legally?

Acabo de renovar mi tarjeta de residente temporal por 3 años más, que necesito hacer para mantener mi

camioneta aquí legalmente?

El INM no expide más FM3, debido al cambio de las calidades migratorias: Visitantes, Residentes

Temporales o Permanentes. Si aplico a una calidad migratoria de Residente Temporal o Permanente no

podrá tener su vehículo en el país tendrá que retornarlo, al extranjero y realizar una importación definitiva

si el vehículo cumple con los requisitos para la importación definitiva.

If you have the immigration conditions of permanent or temporary resident, you will no longer be able to

legally keep your vehicle in Mexico. You may apply for permanent importation of your vehicle if it meets the

requirements.

Please explain the relationship between the new immigration categories and the ability to operate foreign

plated vehicles. Many folks have obtained their 'FM2/3' for the purposes of leaving and operating their foreign

plated vehicle in Mexico. Will this continue? What happens to this relationship after someone has maxed out

on their time in a 'temporary resident' status?

Favor de explicar la nueva relación entre las nuevas condiciones migratorias y la habilidad de importar

vehículos temporalmente o permanentemente a Mexico. Qué pasa con un vehículo cuando alguien ha agotado

el máximo de renovaciones en una residencia temporal?

Por el momento solo los visitantes puede tener un vehículo temporalmente en el país por 6 meses o 180

días con entradas múltiples por el periodo de un año a partir de la primera entrada, si es residente

permanente tiene que hacer una importación definitiva, para resientes Temporales la situación es la misma

por el momento.

At this moment only visitors on tourist visas can temporarily import vehicles for a maximum period of 6

months or 180 days with multiple entries within a 1 year period. The only option for temporary or

permanent residents at this moment is a permanent importation.

If you are here on Temporada, you can no longer drive a U.S. plated car. You can't import your car unless it fits the current NAFTA rules for origin and age. Even though they are taking away what used to be legal under Article 106, there's absolutely no amnesty from the NAFTA rules. If you brought a newer than 6 year old car, even though it is NAFTA made, you cannot import it at the time you renew your visa because it is too new.

How will it work to legalize a vehicle that is less than ten years old?

Como se puede importar temporalmente un vehículo cuyo modelo es mas reciente que 10 años.

Para la importación temporal no importa el modelo año del vehículo.

Para la importación definitiva según el TLCAN este año aplica para vehículos originarios usados,

provenientes de USA y CANADA que tengan por lo menos 6 años de antigüedad (Contactar A.A.)

For temporary importation the year of the vehicle does not matter. For a permanent importation according

to this year’s NAFTA regulations the vehicle must be at least 6 years old (please contact your customs

authorities)

And there's no grace period on this.

Will there be a grace period for long time Mexican residents who are US citizens to import their cars that are

older than 2007?

Bajo las nuevas regulaciones, habrá un periodo de amnistía para residentes de Mexico cuyos vehículos son

modelos anteriores al 2007?

No se dan periodos de gracia. Artículo 5o.- Las disposiciones fiscales que establezcan cargas a los

particulares y las que señalan excepciones a las mismas, así como las que fijan las infracciones y sanciones,

son de aplicación estricta.

Sorry, no grace periods allowed in accordance to the 5th article of the Mexican Customs Law.

Put this together with the new income rules and I'd say it spells out, "Gringo go home unless you're a snowbird or short time tourist.

Here's the source:

http://yucalandia.com/2013/02/13/aduana-proposal-to-allow-existing-foreign-plated-tip-cars-to-be-permanently-imported/

Discussion of the meeting conducted by INM and Aduana in Vallarta

[Marieluise]

Spencer,

Input on this please!!

[Intercasa]

???? Until something is officially published it is the same we have been speculating on for about 2 years.

[Mainecoons]

Spencer the PRESENTATION WAS MADE BY INM AND ADUANA IN VALLARTA YESTERDAY! Check the links, please.

[CWB]

I wonder why they no longer want us here. They seem to be doing everything they can to make it difficult for people who have lived here for years and making it very undesirable for anyone considering moving here.

[More Liana]

Mainecoons, I have the same doubts Spencer does. I read everything in the links. I hunted for information directly from that newspaper. There's really no indication anywhere that this is an official document or that it is the truth. Plus, there are glaring inconsistencies in the document. It's simply going to inflame people unnecessarily.

When Spencer says 'published', he doesn't mean in a local or even national newspaper. He means in the Diario Oficial de la Federación, where new laws are published prior to going into effect. http://www.dof.gob.mx/

[Intercasa]

I will believe it when I see it in writing officially. I have seen so many seminars by attorneys, "aduana" people and immigration and this has gone on for 2 years now. My office called aduana in Mexico City and got a different answer and there is where they make the rules.

The easiest and safest thing is to ditch any non Mexican plated car. Nationalization may be possible but in the past week I saw documents from 3 nationalized vehicles, all fake!!!! There are so many scams going on. I won't touch nationalizations with a 10 foot pole! Mexican plated cars might run a bit more but then you can sell them for more, just another one time cost of living here. Insurance is a bit extra but you cannot always have it all. And you would be surprised how many foreigners have cars that are not worth nationalizing!

[Travis]

Put this together with the new income rules and I'd say it spells out, "Gringo go home unless you're a snowbird or short time tourist.

If the information in that presentation turns out to be accurate, I read it differently than you do. To me it reads, "You can no longer bring a foreign-plated car into Mexico under a Temporary Import Permit and expect to keep it here permanently". And that's all it says. Temporary Import Permits are actually going to be Temporary.

In other words, it seems they're saying, "If you want to live here either full- or part-time on a long-term or permanent basis, you'll either need to nationalize your previously imported vehicle, or buy one here that already has Mexican plates." It actually makes sense!

I realize a lot of us have been using Article 106 for a long time as a workaround (and a clumsy one at that), and this will force a lot of us - including me - to make a decision about the foreign-plated cars we've had down here, but that's just another tope in the road, I figure. Bottom line appears to be: If you want to live in Mexico long-term, get a Mexican-plated car.

It's not hard to buy a car here, is it?

And that's only IF this turns out to be the official policy. And boy.... IF this turns out to be the new reality, the local transitos are going to have a field day!

[Mainecoons]

These aren't new laws. They are citing their interpretation of existing laws including the immigration law passed over a year ago. Read the transcript. That is what they are citing.

We were told at the first of the year that the car rules would be coming about now.

Again, let's remember that this was an OFFICIAL presentation by Aduana and INM yesterday in Vallarta.

Spencer, if your office was told something different, WHEN did you call and WHAT did they say EXACTLY please?

[Intercasa]

We were told by Aduana in Mexico City that they are treating temporal as old FM2 and FM3 and can keep their cars and permanente cannot keep them but then again talk is cheap, and when you call the IRS they are only correct 60% of the time. Everybody wants information, I get HUGE amounts of emails which flood my inbox and my clients are suffering we try to get back to everybody but some have fallen through the cracks. This whole new law things is a royal mess to say the least.

[Mainecoons]

We were told by Aduana in Mexico City that they are treating temporal as old FM2 and FM3 and can keep their cars and permanente cannot keep them but then again talk is cheap, and when you call the IRS they are only correct 60% of the time. Everybody wants information, I get HUGE amounts of emails which flood my inbox and my clients are suffering we try to get back to everybody but some have fallen through the cracks. This whole new law things is a royal mess to say the least.

THAT'S FOR SURE!

[More Liana]

These aren't new laws. They are citing their interpretation of existing laws including the immigration law passed over a year ago. Read the transcript. That is what they are citing.

We were told at the first of the year that the car rules would be coming about now.

Again, let's remember that this was an OFFICIAL presentation by Aduana and INM yesterday in Vallarta.

Spencer, if your office was told something different, WHEN did you call and WHAT did they say EXACTLY please?

Mainecoons, I don't see anything in your original post or in its links that would indicate that Aduana and INM presented this. Sorry to be the doubting Thomas, but...

[Mainecoons]

Go back and look again. Very clearly stated.

In the comments on our Importing and Driving a Car in Mexico: A reader, Don Saigle, posted this interesting report based on what he heard at a joint INM / SAT presentation today (2/13/2013):

Attended presentation today by INM and SAT in Nuevo Vallarta.

Scroll down, there's a confirming report:

I too was at the Nuevo Vallarta meeting today hosted by Consular Agent Trainor. IF I also heard correctly, the Aduana official stated that TIP foreign plated cars currently owned by EITHER current or future Residente Temporal and Residente Permanente holders would have to leave Mexico at the time of status change as they are no longer legal.

[Mad_Max]

Mainecoons, I don't see anything in your original post or in its links that would indicate that Aduana and INM presented this. Sorry to be the doubting Thomas, but...

There was a meeting today in Nayarit - and someone was kind enough to send the power point presentations to me. Interesting presentations - but not much new

https://docs.google.com/file/d/12sU0KQIFJXG0dOvSr3WFNuHJKD8z7Yu2KgUB9IL5vkxVPm9fimpvbyaTFZVt/edit?usp=sharing

https://docs.google.com/file/d/1BFEi917EG4i45QvuBhxmsXuEAvMuBo9RaXhkgAFs_ZNscNmWM_Wfu8LaAQml/edit?usp=sharing

[Mainecoons]

This is what I got when I tried both those links:

Sorry, we were unable to find the document at the original source. Verify that the document still exists.

You can also try to download the original document by clicking here. Alternatively, you can view the plain HTML (automatically redirecting).

It didn't redirect.

[More Liana]

There was a meeting today in Nayarit - and someone was kind enough to send the power point presentations to me. I haven't read the documents yet - it is on google docs and I have indicated that anyone with the link should be able to read it - right now I don't know the difference between the two documents - haven't read them yet

https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&pid=gmail&attid=0.1&thid=13cdb38c57134730&mt=application/vnd.openxmlformats-officedocument.presentationml.presentation&url=https://mail.google.com/mail/u/0/?ui%3D2%26ik%3D06ec0eccdd%26view%3Datt%26th%3D13cdb38c57134730%26attid%3D0.1%26disp%3Dsafe%26zw&sig=AHIEtbSWMrd8hyWB6A2Cgn8lhrKxB135rA

https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&pid=gmail&attid=0.1&thid=13cdb3a38df6740d&mt=application/vnd.ms-powerpoint&url=https://mail.google.com/mail/u/0/?ui%3D2%26ik%3D06ec0eccdd%26view%3Datt%26th%3D13cdb3a38df6740d%26attid%3D0.1%26disp%3Dsafe%26zw&sig=AHIEtbSi0bEoKu0C0dIwI9dva6wmmGzhzA

Neither link works. Each takes me to a place that tells me my gmail account is down. Guess what? It's not, I am signed in and often use Google Docs. Something is fishy here.

[Mad_Max]

Neither link works. Each takes me to a place that tells me my gmail account is down. Guess what? It's not, I am signed in and often use Google Docs. Something is fishy here.

please try again - I changed access to public....... if that doesn't work, you can pm me with your email address and I will email them to you - about 7 mb and you need power point to read or google docs can open/read the presentation if you have gmail.

[satnrose]

This is the first year in seven years I hear folks saying......"enuff". They are considering leaving for a lot of reasons. This car mess will likely be the straw for some.

[Mainecoons]

please try again - I changed access to public....... if that doesn't work, you can pm me with your email address and I will email them to you - about 7 mb and you need power point to read or google docs can open/read the presentation if you have gmail.

Give us the short version. Does the Nayarit presentation confirm the Vallarta one?

Still getting the same error message when I try to open them.

[More Liana]

please try again - I changed access to public....... if that doesn't work, you can pm me with your email address and I will email them to you - about 7 mb and you need power point to read or google docs can open/read the presentation if you have gmail.

Doesn't work. Gives me the same message. Thanks for the offer, but I'll pass.

[freshjuice23]

AAAAAAH! Gringo says "don't take my car away from me" Snow bird "says are there buses there?"

a snow bird

[Mad_Max]

Doesn't work. Gives me the same message. Thanks for the offer, but I'll pass.

Sorry it doesn't work. Obviously it works for me - so i am clueless as to why it doesn't work.

Basically 2 presentations - 1 on immigration - and I think that pretty much matches the local information. The one on vehicles specifically says - at this moment - so there is no change at this time from Aduna - but obviously everyone hopes there will be positive news in the near future.

So as for the post heading - new rules; there are no new rules for vehicles AT THIS TIME

Update

And I think this should work now

https://docs.google.com/file/d/12sU0KQIFJXG0dOvSr3WFNuHJKD8z7Yu2KgUB9IL5vkxVPm9fimpvbyaTFZVt/edit?usp=sharing

https://docs.google.com/file/d/1BFEi917EG4i45QvuBhxmsXuEAvMuBo9RaXhkgAFs_ZNscNmWM_Wfu8LaAQml/edit?usp=sharing

[Islander]

We are from Canada

We moved from province of Alberta to province of British Columbia and we got 3 months to change to BC plates.We also had to dich the vehicle because it did not meet the BC standards (could not get the plates) and was not worth to fix it. Mexico is catching up. Next will be taxes. It is a good deal now for all NOBies but I do not expect it to last.

Cheers

[Frijoles]

Give us the short version. Does the Nayarit presentation confirm the Vallarta one?

I believe the presentation was in Nuevo Vallarta, which is in Nayarit.

[bezerk]

That is correct Frijoles...I too had the documents emailed tome from the meeting but have yet to read...I have a 2005 minivan in excellent condition with extremely low mileage so amhoping I can keep it....but will see...I renewed my FM3 right before new laws went intoeffect so I have a year to figure this out I guess...sigh..