21 replies to this topic

[Mark_T]

I have read a lot of stories (rumors?) about people who were being robbed in their home or on the street and defended themself and ended up in jail. One was where a man killed a burglar who was attacking him in his own house.

Without considering retaliation from friends and family, how far can someone go in Mexico (specifically Jalisco) in defending themselves from harm?

Can you have and use a Taser for defense?

I can't be theer tonight, but would like to know what the police and mayor (or whoever official is there) have to say about this; or will they just dance around the questions?

Thanks.

M.

[Griffin]

Vendors on Mecardolibre who sell stun guns and tasers have answered that a weapon that does not cause permanent injury is legal in Mexico.

[Intercasa]

Article 13 of the Jalisco State Penal Code provides for a justification for fighting back

Se presumirá que actúa en legítima defensa quien de noche rechace un escalamiento o fractura de las cercas, paredes o entradas de su casa o departamento habitado o de sus dependencias interiores. La misma presunción favorecerá al que dañe a un intruso que encontrare en la habitación propia o familiar, o de aquella persona a quien tenga obligación de defender, o en lugar donde se encuentren sus bienes propios o ajenos que deba cuidar, siempre que la presencia del extraño ocurra de noche o en circunstancias que revelen la posibilidad de una agresión por el intruso. El Ministerio Público en la averiguación previa, resolverá de oficio si opera o no la legítima defensa.

It is presumed that one acted in legitimate defense when someone at night enters their home or habited apartment scaling walls or breaking fences or entries or the interior. The same presumption favors the person who injures an intruder that is found in their own room or of a family member or other person they have the obligation to defend or other place of their property or of others that they care for whenever the presence of the stranger occurs at night or in circumstances that reveal the possibility of an aggression by the inrtuder. The Ministerio Publico in the initial investigation will resolve whether or not it was in legitimate defense.

[Alex]

I think the basic procedure is that the police will arrest you if you actually kill someone, whether by gun, taser, knife or traffic accident. Then the Ministerio does the investigation. If it's a clear case of self defense within the walls of your home, you will be released in a matter or days...maybe less. Using an illegal weapon, of course, is an additional crime. This may keep you locked up longer.

[Mark_T]

A "matter of days" in a Mexican jail. That in and of itself is scary.

And what about on the street?

[Alex]

A "matter of days" in a Mexican jail. That in and of itself is scary.

And what about on the street?

I'm reminded of what happened in Chapala last year. An elderly woman accidentally ran over and killed her good friend while parking her car along the main drag. She was taken into custody and spent a day or two in the Chapala jail. From what I read on this forum, the cops were very sympathetic to the woman and tried to make her stay as comfortable and as brief as possible. If you pull a George Zimmerman, and shoot someone to death on the street, do not expect the same kind of consideration. You absolutely do not have the right to carry a weapon outside your home. If you beat someone to death with your fists, even in self defense, do not expect much sympathy from the authorities. You will have to answer to the equivalent charge of manslaughter.

[manny]

alex, 1) the lady accidently killed a CANADIAN friend. if it was a mexican then she may still be there & treated in a abusive manner. also she had to pay many many thousands of USD to get out. (besides attorney fees). it was not easy to come up w/the $ from a jail cell. the consulate was of no help to her. (i know the details, but they are personal). 2) i am a bit confused as to what spencer said: is it only nighttime that you can defend yourself in your home? what if they come in daytime armed?? 3) alex how do you know this issue will be addressed tonight? do you have a friend who will ask? 3) i read on this forum (or another) that an american man shot an intruder in floresta. does anyone know what happened?

[jrm30655]

My theory is that I'm going to protect myself. A few years in prison is better than eternity in a coffin.

Lawyers and money stand a chance of getting you out of jail. Don't know of any way to get out of a coffin.

As the American saying goes: Better to be tried by 12 than carried by 6........

[manny]

JRM: you wont make it a few years in a mexican prison. better have a good attorney, carry his card w/you @all times. keep the # near your phone. & be prepared to pay ALOT to get out of jail. other than that, yes defend yourself!

[Alex]

alex, 1) the lady accidently killed a CANADIAN friend. if it was a mexican then she may still be there & treated in a abusive manner. also she had to pay many many thousands of USD to get out. (besides attorney fees). it was not easy to come up w/the $ from a jail cell. the consulate was of no help to her. (i know the details, but they are personal).

Here's a clue: Bail Bond. The nationality of the dead woman is irrelevant. However, the nationality of the woman responsible for her death is relevant. As a foreign citizen, she is immediately considered a flight risk. This is how things work in civil societies, such as, the United States and Canada. Please do not pretend otherwise.

[PV Kids]

alex, 1) the lady accidently killed a CANADIAN friend. if it was a mexican then she may still be there & treated in a abusive manner. also she had to pay many many thousands of USD to get out. (besides attorney fees). it was not easy to come up w/the $ from a jail cell. the consulate was of no help to her. (i know the details, but they are personal). 2) i am a bit confused as to what spencer said: is it only nighttime that you can defend yourself in your home? what if they come in daytime armed?? 3) alex how do you know this issue will be addressed tonight? do you have a friend who will ask? 3) i read on this forum (or another) that an american man shot an intruder in floresta. does anyone know what happened?

Reread the translation:

whenever the presence of the stranger occurs at night or in circumstances that reveal the possibility of an aggression by the inrtuder. The Ministerio Publico in the initial investigation will resolve whether or not it was in legitimate defense.

[manny]

very weird translation. for me it says, night OK. any other time will be reviewed. they play games. in any event, that meeting seems like a mystery. w/all the important issues (see mexicoconnect) i hear nothing.

[Canamex]

.... As a foreign citizen, she is immediately considered a flight risk. This is how things work in civil societies, such as, the United States and Canada. Please do not pretend otherwise.

Are you kidding? Do you really know how the laws work in other "civil societies"? Ever heard of innocent until proved guilty?

[trampampam]

It is better to allow technology to fight for you. Build your own security system, which may help to drive your intruder away:

1. All lights in your house, outside and inside, and very loud unbearable sound will turn ON by pressing one button on your remote control, which is always with you (on your wrist maybe).

2. Install many security cameras around your house and inside of the house. They need to blink with red light, so that to indicate that they are recording at night too.

3. Have a safe room with metal door and no windows. Have a way to view all your cameras from the safe room and call from this room to help you.

4. Let everyone know that you have an advanced security system.

Remember, that your dog can be easily poisoned or shut. So, the dogs may not work for your protection.

[manny]

trampampam, thats not great PR for moving to mexico. if i needed a "safe room" that would be a deal breaker. & watching my home 24/7, even while having lunch? from my wrist? im not the FBI, or obama. security is important, but who would seek this out?

[Alex]

Are you kidding? Do you really know how the laws work in other "civil societies"? Ever heard of innocent until proved guilty?

And here's a clue for you: Dominique Strauss-Kahn.

[CocinaMod]

Keep it on topic or this thread will be closed.

[verchiel]

Mexico follows the Napoleanic Code, a part of which holds that you are guilty until you prove yourself innocent. Hence the reason that, if arrested, you are generally held until a court can ascertain whether there is enough evidence of probable innocence to set you free on bond until a full court investigation can take place. With variations here and there, France, Italy, the Netherlands, Spain, Portugal and Belgium and several Latin American countries base their law in it. So does the state of Louisiana in the USA.

[Alex]

It should be noted that Mexico is currently in the process of instituting judicial reforms which will make it easier to ball out while awaiting the outcome of the investigation. It should also be noted that Mexico does not practice the death penalty. If you kill someone, even in self defense, you will have imposed a penalty on the offender that even the state is denied.

[bigd]

And here's a clue for you: Dominique Strauss-Kahn.

Who is This person?