34 replies to this topic

[Carmela]

Does anyone have any experience with or know if a flat screen TV is an energy hog? Anybody have any before flatscreen/after flatscreen comparisons? Also, do TVs in Mexico have energy usage info as they do in the US?

[AlanMexicali]

All things with motors, the larger the more they use, heating elements, electric clothes dryer are very high consumption and anything that gives off a lot of heat are high consumers. Electronics, fluorescent lights and flat screens are not anywhere near the consumption of the others except powerful stereos, the louder the more they consume because the power supply and output electronics do get hot, on very low volume they use significantly less. Example: charging a dead car battery with a large charger heats up and consumes more in the beginning and less near the end of the charge. Doesn't draw as much current. I = E over R [current = voltage over resistance].

[elrich]

I have a 55 inch flatscreen television it has increased my electric bill 130.00 pesos each billing. I do have a energy saving setting but I do not use it, it makes the picture to dark.

[mikewlig]

Here's a good comparison of old and new technology:
http://www.guardian....-tv-electricity

[Chooch57]

In another word, if you have CRT (Cathode Ray Tube) TV they eat a lots of power. The falt screen TV have imporved a lot in the past 5 years and they also came down in price in North America.

[Ajijic Ron]

This is my very first post on chapala.com, not sure why I didn't know about this before! OK, so T.V's are surprisingly low energy users (newer models).
If you've seen a dramitic increase in your CFE bill, it could be result of many different things. Most often, the issues I've seen were either the CFE was
estimating the comsumption of the home and in doing so underestimated and for who knows how long. In this case, they will not admit fault and forgive debt,
but take it back on a monthly basis. The other is more obvious and that could be that you jumped into the higher tariff (DAC). If you have had 3 consecutive
billing cycles with 500 or more kilowatt hours being used, your bill will significantly increase.

[John Shrall]

I did a Google search and found an interesting article that lists many TV's and associated energy consumption. The cost per year column assumes a rate of 11.55 cents per kWh but in Mexico if you're on DAC it's about 4 pesos per kWh when factoring in IVA. Completely turning off the power source to TVs and satellite boxes when not in use makes a big difference in electric usage. If a box is warm to the touch it's using electricity even when turned off.

http://reviews.cnet....sumption-chart/

[johanson]

This is my very first post on chapala.com, not sure why I didn't know about this before! OK, so T.V's are surprisingly low energy users (newer models).
If you've seen a dramitic increase in your CFE bill, it could be result of many different things. Most often, the issues I've seen were either the CFE was
estimating the comsumption of the home and in doing so underestimated and for who knows how long. In this case, they will not admit fault and forgive debt,
but take it back on a monthly basis. The other is more obvious and that could be that you jumped into the higher tariff (DAC). If you have had 3 consecutive
billing cycles with 500 or more kilowatt hours being used, your bill will significantly increase.

Welcome aboard Ron.

Please go to the CFE webpage. You will see that it is not 3 billing periods but 12 months for DAC.

Take a look here http://www.cfe.gob.m...cetutarifa.aspx

Once there, left-click on "Domesticas de alto Consumo". Then read on (en Espan~ol)

[Mainecoons]

LEDs use less power than the older LCDs. And both use a lot less than the old CRTs.

[More Liana]

We work our you-know-whats off to stay out of the DAC. For us, that looks like:

• unplug the 46" LED TV and its heavy-duty surge protector when the TV is not on. Yes, it uses less than a CRT, less than a plasma, and less than an LCD--but why just give CFE money?
  
• Our TV is in use approximagely 2 hours per day, so it's unplugged almost all the time
  
• turn off the coffee pot unless it is busy making coffee--ours has a hot-water tank, but 15 minutes on in the morning and it's good to go.
  
• turn off the computers, the monitors, AND the UPS box when we get off line for the night
  
• turn off all lights in all rooms when we are out of those rooms
  
• unplug anything that has a little red light on it when it's turned off. Those appliances still suck electricity.
  
• all but one of our clocks run on batteries. Plug-in clocks cost money to run.
  
• laundry once a week, gas dryer
  
• the maid irons once a week
  
• microwave is used once a day for 39 seconds--literally, I run it to warm milk for coffee in the AM.

So far, we have been over 500kwh ONCE in the last year and we are nowhere near DAC--and we're not going there, either.

[AlanMexicali]

We work our you-know-whats off to stay out of the DAC. For us, that looks like:

• unplug the 46" LED TV and its heavy-duty surge protector when the TV is not on. Yes, it uses less than a CRT, less than a plasma, and less than an LCD--but why just give CFE money?
  
• Our TV is in use approximagely 2 hours per day, so it's unplugged almost all the time
  
• turn off the coffee pot unless it is busy making coffee--ours has a hot-water tank, but 15 minutes on in the morning and it's good to go.
  
• turn off the computers, the monitors, AND the UPS box when we get off line for the night
  
• turn off all lights in all rooms when we are out of those rooms
  
• unplug anything that has a little red light on it when it's turned off. Those appliances still suck electricity.
  
• all but one of our clocks run on batteries. Plug-in clocks cost money to run.
  
• laundry once a week, gas dryer
  
• the maid irons once a week
  
• microwave is used once a day for 39 seconds--literally, I run it to warm milk for coffee in the AM.

So far, we have been over 500kwh ONCE in the last year and we are nowhere near DAC--and we're not going there, either.

All the things you mentioned are OK except the TV, surge protector and other things with the red lights only supply 5 or 12 volts DC to a memory chip and draws such an insignificant amount of amps that it would be more trouble unplugging when not being used than what you would actually save, That includes computers and monitors, microwaves, VCRs, DVD players, cable box or satellite receivers, even with the clock running. Maybe roughly a dollar or less a month. I don't know about a UPS supply. But if it is a routine then I would continue.

[OasisCloud]

All the things you mentioned are OK except the TV, surge protector and other things with the red lights only supply 5 or 12 volts DC to a memory chip and draws such an insignificant amount of amps that it would be more trouble unplugging when not being used than what you would actually save, That includes computers and monitors, microwaves, VCRs, DVD players, cable box or satellite receivers, even with the clock running. Maybe roughly a dollar or less a month. I don't know about a UPS supply. But if it is a routine then I would continue.

You may be surprised how "insignificant" these things actually are (NOT). Yes, it is only 5 or 12 volts DC, but that isn't what is important. Each of these converter devices draws a few watts AC when plugged in. That is even if the device on the other end isn't plugged in, turned on, or drawing power in any way. A few watts may seem insignificant, but many people may have 5, 10, or even 20 of these devices plugged in all of the time. They add up and do become significant.

You should look at anything that draws power on a continual basis in your home and cut it back if you can. You may be very surprised how it does add up.

[AlanMexicali]

You may be surprised how "insignificant" these things actually are (NOT). Yes, it is only 5 or 12 volts DC, but that isn't what is important. Each of these converter devices draws a few watts AC when plugged in. That is even if the device on the other end isn't plugged in, turned on, or drawing power in any way. A few watts may seem insignificant, but many people may have 5, 10, or even 20 of these devices plugged in all of the time. They add up and do become significant.

You should look at anything that draws power on a continual basis in your home and cut it back if you can. You may be very surprised how it does add up.

Watts = Volts x Amps [in milliamps ] 1/1000 of an amp

Watts is a unit of power having the dimensions (energy per unit time):

M L² / T² divided by T = M L ² / T ³

Note: A kilowatt-hour is a 1000 watts times one hour = an energy unit.

Example: A computer not on draws maybe I/100 of an amp. That is .001 amps. The voltage at the plug is 110 volts. 110 X .001= That equals about 100 milliwatts [.11watts] of power, so in 30 days it is not even many watts that it is consuming which is a few 1/1000ths of a kilowatt hour. In dollar amounts this is pennies, not dollars. As I said before 10 devices, some like a power strip which draw almost nothing will barely add up to a dollar a month consumption.

The non digitally controller ceiling fans on the low speed that has the 110 volts supplied to the motor and shuts it on and off constantly to control the speed. Every time it connects back to the 110 volts there is a voltage and current spike. This uses more amps that if it was left on high speed over many hours of use, costing more or approximately the same on low than on high in the long run. It depends on how long it is running, of course.

[Atlas]

1/100 of an Amp would be .01 Amp. (not .001) Pls start over.

[Intercasa]

I have a 32" mounted on the wall of my office and a security camera is connected to it to view people at my door and it is on daily 9am to 4pm or so and my bills are not really noteworthy.

[AlanMexicali]

1/100 of an Amp would be .01 Amp. (not .001) Pls start over.

It was supposed to be 1/1000 of an amp = a milliamp, which the formula is calculated in, sorry.

[John Shrall]

I no longer have my notes from my solar system research but I was amazed at how much electricity my TV configuration drew while turned off. I have a voltage regulator connected to the wall with a Tripp-Lite UPS connected to it. I plug a power strip into the UPS and then a rear projection TV and Shaw HD receiver into the power strip. The voltage regulator, UPS and satellite receiver are all hot to the touch when off.

If I remember right when I inserted the Kill-A-Watt device in front of all these components in the off position I was drawing 40 or 50 watts. That's what shocked me. If you have a 40 watt bulb plugged in all day that adds up to just under 1kWh per day times 62 days in a CFE period you've burned about 60kWh for reason at all.

Multiply that by the 2 or 3 other places in the house where you have voltage regulators and other devices plugged in and over the period of years you've burned hundreds of dollars with nothing to show for it.

Now I toggle the voltage regulator, then power on the UPS just whenever I want to use the TV. That's only a few hours for the entire week. Reverse the process when I'm done and all the components stay cold to the touch.

The Kill-A-Watt device is a great eye-opener and is a handy tool to have around so long as CFE rates are so high. Test the TV or whatever you want to measure and then decide if the amount of energy consumed while off is enough to warrant pulling the power when not in use.

[AlanMexicali]

I no longer have my notes from my solar system research but I was amazed at how much electricity my TV configuration drew while turned off. I have a voltage regulator connected to the wall with a Tripp-Lite UPS connected to it. I plug a power strip into the UPS and then a rear projection TV and Shaw HD receiver into the power strip. The voltage regulator, UPS and satellite receiver are all hot to the touch when off.

If I remember right when I inserted the Kill-A-Watt device in front of all these components in the off position I was drawing 40 or 50 watts. That's what shocked me. If you have a 40 watt bulb plugged in all day that adds up to just under 1kWh per day times 62 days in a CFE period you've burned about 60kWh for reason at all.

Multiply that by the 2 or 3 other places in the house where you have voltage regulators and other devices plugged in and over the period of years you've burned hundreds of dollars with nothing to show for it.

Now I toggle the voltage regulator, then power on the UPS just whenever I want to use the TV. That's only a few hours for the entire week. Reverse the process when I'm done and all the components stay cold to the touch.

The Kill-A-Watt device is a great eye-opener and is a handy tool to have around so long as CFE rates are so high. Test the TV or whatever you want to measure and then decide if the amount of energy consumed while off is enough to warrant pulling the power when not in use.

"Standby Power: It may surprise you to hear that TVs use power even when they're not turned on. So that the TV is ready to respond to the remote in an instant, all sets use what's called phantom or standby power. Tests have revealed that standby power consumption varied somewhat among different TVs, but in general newer models consume negligible power when turned off with the best units consuming less than 1 watt in standby."

I don't know if a UPS supply draws power after the batteries are fully charged but your flat screen doesn't use much power when off. The satellite receiver has a similar system in standby and a computer does not so it barely draws any power when off as does a power strip which does even have a memory chip to keep on, but a power regulator is on even if no units are turned on. A satellite receiver builds up ambient heat over hours when not on but is still less than a watt or two. So 40 or 50 watts is probably 20 times or more too much for 10 or so non voltage regulated devices sitting plugged in and not turned on. Your system is unique and you have added specialty items. I would think once the UPS batteries are fully charge it does not draw much current except to keep a couple chips on a control PC board active.

[More Liana]

What I know is that what I do has made a significant difference in the CFE bill. For two seconds every evening, I unplug a couple of things. For that, I save about 1000 pesos (yes, one thousand) each bimestre. As other posters have mentioned, everything adds up.

[MtnMama]

When we lived NOB, we belonged to the Colorado Renewable Energy Society. (CRES) One of their meetings had a fascinating lecture on the little black cubes they called "vampires". Very enlightening. And unplugging them does make a big difference.