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Eric Blair

Thumb down and thumb up. Disaster averted.

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A few months ago, we found a large lump on one of our dog's front leg. It was new since we always make a point to watch for any potential signs of problems.

We took her to the "Pet Place" (next to Benno computer store). The vet said it was a tumor and should be removed and a biopsy done.Agree 100%.

The biopsy came back and we kept a copy. It said there was a log-grade tumor (Cancer).

After 2-3 weeks or so, all was well.

A couple of months later, we found two more tumors on the same leg and took our girl back to the vet. She (Vet) said she could remove them and give a course of Chemo. to see what happens.

At that point, I had the biopsy report translated to English.

Having a slight medical background, something jumped right out to me. The report said there had not been a "clean margin." When a tumor is removed, standard procedure is to remove a margin of univaded tissue to make sure all the tumor is removed. That had not only not been done, but thetumor had been cut open when no clean margin was taken. This allowed cancer cells to "spill" out guaranteeing more tumors.

I asked the Vet why the removal didn't include a clean margin. She said the tumor was very large (agreed) and if she had taken it out with a clean margin, there would have been too large an area of skin removed, and since the skin was thin due to being stretched by the tumor she couldn’t do a proper closure so she opted not to do a clean margin, but take as much as possible.

My first through, that I didn't ask was why not do a skin graft?

We made an appointment for the surgery and course of Chemo she recommended, but immediately went to Dr. Ladron. I was told by the vet at Pet Place, she had interned with Dr. Ladron before going out on her own.

 Dr. Ladron said it wasn't two tmors, but one elongated tumor. He said he would remove it and do a skin flap so cover the surgical site. I asked Dr. Ladron why that wasn't done by the first Vet. He did not respond.

I am familiar with the procedure. In case you're interested: Flap surgery is a technique in plastic and reconstructive surgery where any type of tissue is lifted from a donor site and moved to a recipient site with an intact blood supply. This is similar to but different from a graft, which does not have an intact blood supply and therefore relies on growth of new blood vessels (Thanks Wikipedia).

When we picked our girl up after the surgery, we were shown a cellphone video of the tumor. It looked to be about 2" long.

Our girl came through the procedure very well and follow-up was great.

Our  takeaway from all of this was stay with the tried and true, even if it's more pesos.

Stay tuned. We had another human medical disaster that happened locally. It is still ongoing so won't say anything now, but it will put you on alert when I post it, and I will. It's something I would wish on my worst enemy, but not someone I care about, like, love or even a stranger I don't know.

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I am just going to point out that this type of thing could happen with any Vet or any local doctor. Several years ago, I took my dog to Ladrones who wanted to do an unnecessary, very expensive procedure due to a misdiagnosis on their part. Mr Google is indeed your friend. I did research, determined a more likely cause, followed the suggested protocol, and the dog lived 6 more years without further problems. IMHO they are not better or perfect, they just charge a lot more.

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Don't do chemo!!!  It does not cure. It harms.

I have a really great resource to share for all pet owners.  I don't know how many are aware of the cancer epidemic among animals.  The good new is prevention and recovery are possible.  We are causing these cancers without realizing it.

Please check out https://go2.thetruthaboutcancer.com/pet-docuseries/replay/?a_aid=58af0cbe3fcf8&a_bid=7f0b626f&inf_contact_key=405007c5ae556d53c3e437b7abb1693557f925c162d441d30e286530c92ce6c7

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Sorry Zeb. Chemo does NOT harm dogs and in fact I know of MANY who have come thru' with flying colors and lived long after, totally healthy. Don't know or understand the differences between animal and human chemo, but only know it's huge.

And to Eric:  You did the right thing in the end. Best wishes for full recovery this time. And really, you can not have expected Hector to say anything regarding Berenice, could you? No Doctor, human or otherwise, wants to get into that can of worms and rightly so.

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MtnMama is correct, however it is called negligence/malpractice. It would also be poor training. Often discussing the . reason(s) something happens is academic, unless you or a loved one suffers the consequences. When something happens due to negligence, malpractice or poor training,, that doesn't help the person/animal who suffers as a result.

Just look at the recent example in Mx. when a young child died because a fatal dose of Lido

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Doctors, MD or DVM often bury their mistakes.

Of course Dr. Ladron wouldn't say anything against a "brother" practitioner. In every group there is an well known but unwritten Code of Science.  The thought is, "There but for the grace  - - - - - "

Still, when any doctor makes an error, they should, IMO, be called on it. I'm not saying take them to the "back 40" and shoot them, but if nothing is said an no consequences, however slight, then they keep making the same mistake.

I also did read that dogs handle chemo. much better than humans.

 So far, the little girl is doing fine.

 

 

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1 hour ago, Eric Blair said:

Doctors, MD or DVM often bury their mistakes.

 

That's why they call their profession's a practice.

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Sorry  guys, but docs and other professionals can  be called on the carpet for "maligning" others of the same profession even if they "know things" about said person .  So unless they know you really, really well, they are not going to put themselves in tricky position  regarding another.  Doubt any of you would do it either in their shoes.

Eric, so happy you got where you did, surgery seems to have been successful, and your little girl is recovering.  But as you said earlier.....Still, when any doctor makes an error, they should, IMO, be called on it. Yes, they should -- by the CLIENT or PATIENT, not another  doctor, once a better opinion / resolution has been achieved

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This is the translated lab report.

COMMENTS AND ADDITIONAL FINDINGS:.

This tumor is classified as a low-grade mastocytoma, according to the criteria reported by Riupel, a technique that is considered the most accurate for predicting the behavior of rhizostocytomas. in dogs, which has replaced other techniques previously used and which were based on 3 histological degrees. In it, the histological grade refers to the possibility of recidivism and potential for metastasis at the time of its study, but it should not be interpreted that A low grade tumor rules out the possibility of malignant behavior

In the sections, when examined, the surgical margins are apparently free, although the basal diameter is extremely narrow in some sections <1 mm. Additionally, this situation of the edges must be evaluated with caution, due to the number of cuts examined and the size of the sample remitted, so there could be the possibility of a "tumor leakage.”

=================================================================================================================

 

This should be a warning to all of us.

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Yes, everyone makes mistakes still, every MD, DVM or any other medical discipline where someone uses a scalpel, and the word "tumor," knows if you cut into the tumor when removing it, you will spill the cells into the body of the patient. If they don't know this, they shouldn't have a license IMO.

There is a difference between an honest mistake; a misdiagnosis, but then there is pure negligence. The doctor/nurse who hangs the wrong bag for an IV and the patient dies. Is that a mistake or negligence, or gross negligence?

You may sit a long time at the Ladron Clinic, and that is because, from my observation, they don't rush through a consultation, examination or procedure, they give time.

How far would you forgive if it were your child who this happened to?

 

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You might also note the huge number of people there..... must indicate a lot of people trust what they do, even if the cost is higher.

When I was there yesterday the waiting room was jammed and many were faces I've seen there over many years.

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All folks make mistakes in every occupation. If one person has a complaint that doesn't mean the person is bad.   If I ask a dozen people about a person and six say bad things I probably won't use them.  Vets have a more difficult job than human doctors.  You can't ask your dog how he feels and where does it hurt like a human.  A vet depends on touch, imaging, tests and vision. Yes an owner can help and tell a vet certain things as we know the animals normal behavior. I am always amazed  by a good vet as I worked for one as a kid and learned much from him that has helped me my whole life.  We have had many Vets here and dumped most of them.  In my opinion Ladron is an excellent cat vet. I can't speak for dogs (woof :-)  as we don't have any so my opinion is worthless. He has the right equipment and was able to deal with a very very strange obscure condition my cat had. I do not doubt that some folks have had bad experiences with every vet around even the good ones.  It is such a difficult job sometimes and mistakes can be made by all vets. Watching a good vet is amazing.  Watching a bad one is sad for me.

Thanks for listening

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The Ladron are not perfect, they were treating my dog with hormones for incontinence,, the dog was 3 years old and removed 2 non malignant tumors from her as she was dying of kidney failure which they never diagnosed until she went into convulsions and died..

Nobody is that great and no one is perfect for sure, one thing is for sure is that we will all die eventually good or bad vets good or bad doctors.

The vet who was going to check the kidney function was the one who was threatened of extortion and left town before we had the time to check.. Things happen and that is life.  What is important is for the vets to be responsable and do their best, everyone can make mistakes.

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