Today's Town Topics

[RVGRINGO]

Once upon a time, when I could see bettdr, I did read the part of the Jalisco law that states the fact that a vehicle must be currently registered in its home jurisdiction to be able to circulate here. It is simple common sense and not worthy of a foolish argument about road taxes or what constitutes title or registration in other countries. Simply put; it is a reciprical agreement to recognize the legality of a foreign registration, just as our Jalisco plated car is allowed to drive in the USA with current Jalisco Tarjeta de Circulación. Were that to be out of date, I would get a ticket anywhere.

[Joco]

If you are making your insurance invalid by not complying with the small print in the policy you are breaking the law in most countries.

You deserve whatever the transit cops give you.

Didn't the cops say they don't ask for proof of insurance? I guess if a policy doesn't state anything about a vehicle being currently registered and mine doesn't, then I am not violating the law. I didn't know an insurance carrier dictated local traffic laws.

[Joco]

Once upon a time, when I could see bettdr, I did read the part of the Jalisco law that states the fact that a vehicle must be currently registered in its home jurisdiction to be able to circulate here. It is simple common sense and not worthy of a foolish argument about road taxes or what constitutes title or registration in other countries. Simply put; it is a reciprical agreement to recognize the legality of a foreign registration, just as our Jalisco plated car is allowed to drive in the USA with current Jalisco Tarjeta de Circulación. Were that to be out of date, I would get a ticket anywhere.

In the U.S. if you receive a ticket for an out of date registration or inspection sticker, you have X number of days to make it current and if done the ticket is dismissed. I read here that if one is ticketed for an inspection sticker he has 15 (?) days to correct it. I think Spencer is the person who posted this information. I'm sure the time applies to registrations also. If someone gets a ticket, then send off for a new registration, present to the Court and it is dismissed.

[Mainecoons]

Didn't the cops say they don't ask for proof of insurance? I guess if a policy doesn't state anything about a vehicle being currently registered and mine doesn't, then I am not violating the law. I didn't know an insurance carrier dictated local traffic laws.

We have never been asked for proof of insurance when getting a TIP or when stopped. HOWEVER, if you get in an accident you had darn well better have good insurance WITH on site legal assistance. Otherwise, you could be dealing with anything from having your car confiscated to landing in the slammer.

They don't make it easy to own or drive a car in this country.

[purplebeads]

The other biggie is that NOTARIZED COPIES ARE NOT ACCEPTABLE, you must have originals of driver's license, registration, and if you have a TIP, the original of that form as well.

Way back... the Guad reporter stated you could have a notarized copy of your TIP. The reason being if the car were in an accident you might not be able to retrieve the original.

[Joco]

The other biggie is that NOTARIZED COPIES ARE NOT ACCEPTABLE, you must have originals of driver's license, registration, and if you have a TIP, the original of that form as well.

Way back... the Guad reporter stated you could have a notarized copy of your TIP. The reason being if the car were in an accident you might not be able to retrieve the original.

Spencer said he got this straightened out before with the previous chief and will do it again. The courts have ruled that notarized copies are legal. Drivers license must be an original but the other papers can be notarized copies.

[Tangawizi]

If someone gets a ticket, then send off for a new registration, present to the Court and it is dismissed.

The catch is that we can't "send off for a new registration" from our home jurisdiction (Saskatchewan, Canada) because we have to physically present the car at the registration office and go through a safety and emissions check. At least, this is my understanding. If registering was that easy, we wouldn't be driving around with expired plates in the first place. (I say "we" because even though it's my husband who does the driving, I am obviously affected if there is a serious problem.) It's not because we are too cheap to pay the registration; it's because it is not possible to do it from here. I'm particularly concerned about the possible lack of insurance coverage in case of an accident. My husband feels that since "everyone is doing it" it must be OK. I don't want him to be the first test case that proves it is NOT OK. Sure hope this question can be cleared up once and for all.

Correction: Apparently it is possible to renew online, but the renewer must declare that he and the car are in Saskatchewan. So technically possible, but legally not.

[ChrisB]

everyone isn't doing it .Wake up and see the SD plates.

[FHBOY]

Get out the guns and shoot me, but:

If I moved to another state/province NOB, established a home there, and lived there, there would be no question that I would comply with the vehicle laws of that state/province, which includes a properly registered, inspected and insured vehicle.

It seems as if what I am reading here is the "What can I get away with" argument and "If I get caught...it is unfair." If you live here, and drive here, then it is your responsibility as a resident here, to make sure you are complying with the laws here. An expired NOB tag is breaking the law, so I have read, and if you would get pulled over and fined NOB, why do you not expect that to happen here? You have broken the law.

You afraid of being pulled over with your NOB tag, expired or not? Then do what you need to do to get yourself a Mexican tag. Yeah, it costs money, time and convenience to do it, but you will be complying with the community in which you live. Everything in life costs something.

You want to keep your SD tags, your expired FL tags, your Ontario plates - that's your choice, it makes you an easier target.

[Tangawizi]

everyone isn't doing it .Wake up and see the SD plates.

I believe - although I am not absolutely sure - that the South Dakota plate option isn't available to Canadians. And yes, FHBOY, I agree that following the rules of the jurisdiction in which one is living is the sensible and ethical route to take. But is the option of getting a Mexican driver's licence and plates open to non-permanentes?

[Travis]

You can get a Jalisco Driver's license with a Residente Temporal Visa (or old FM3 or FM2 or the other terminologies) if that's what's in your pocket. You don't have to be "Permanente".

And anyone on earth can buy a Mexican-plated car.

[Joco]

Get out the guns and shoot me, but:

If I moved to another state/province NOB, established a home there, and lived there, there would be no question that I would comply with the vehicle laws of that state/province, which includes a properly registered, inspected and insured vehicle.

It seems as if what I am reading here is the "What can I get away with" argument and "If I get caught...it is unfair." If you live here, and drive here, then it is your responsibility as a resident here, to make sure you are complying with the laws here. An expired NOB tag is breaking the law, so I have read, and if you would get pulled over and fined NOB, why do you not expect that to happen here? You have broken the law.

You afraid of being pulled over with your NOB tag, expired or not? Then do what you need to do to get yourself a Mexican tag. Yeah, it costs money, time and convenience to do it, but you will be complying with the community in which you live. Everything in life costs something.

You want to keep your SD tags, your expired FL tags, your Ontario plates - that's your choice, it makes you an easier target.

If you move from one U.S. state to another it doesn't cost $2000 USD plus to get the new state's license plate. The person won't need to pay a bribe to get a driver's license. For those taxes you are paying to drive on the new state's roads, you actually get lit and decent roads that are safe to drive on at night and don't tear up your vehicle. I think most of us don't mind paying a fair amount, but we don't like paying an exorbitant amount, possibly that is rip off and we have to spend weeks doing it. To compare up North and down here is not an apt comparison.

[ChrisB]

What rock are you under? Have you ever driven through Arkansas? How about the bridges that are always in the news falling down? Have you been asked for a bribe? Now you can report it directly to state authorities, confidentially, through LCS! After the LCS meeting I expect the licensing process will be much easier.

[ChrisB]

Anyone interested in the driving laws (current) can go to the Transito office and buy a manual. I believe their office moved from Riberas. Does anyone know where it is now?

[Joco]

What rock are you under? Have you ever driven through Arkansas? How about the bridges that are always in the news falling down? Have you been asked for a bribe? Now you can report it directly to state authorities, confidentially, through LCS! After the LCS meeting I expect the licensing process will be much easier.

I can't determine to whom you are addressing this but yes I have driven through Arkansas on very good highways without paying a toll. There are some bad bridges in the U.S. Do those equal the bad roads in Mexico? I don't think so. I can avoid bad bridges. I can't avoid the bad roads that ruin tires and suspensions.

If I am stopped in the U.S., I don't worrying that the police officer is wanting a bribe or worse. I don't get threatened with my car being towed if I don't pay a bribe.

I don't know how long you have been here but reporting on the police here has been going on for years. It clears up for a few weeks and then is back to the norm.

[Mainecoons]

Get out the guns and shoot me, but:

If I moved to another state/province NOB, established a home there, and lived there, there would be no question that I would comply with the vehicle laws of that state/province, which includes a properly registered, inspected and insured vehicle.

It seems as if what I am reading here is the "What can I get away with" argument and "If I get caught...it is unfair." If you live here, and drive here, then it is your responsibility as a resident here, to make sure you are complying with the laws here. An expired NOB tag is breaking the law, so I have read, and if you would get pulled over and fined NOB, why do you not expect that to happen here? You have broken the law.

You afraid of being pulled over with your NOB tag, expired or not? Then do what you need to do to get yourself a Mexican tag. Yeah, it costs money, time and convenience to do it, but you will be complying with the community in which you live. Everything in life costs something.

You want to keep your SD tags, your expired FL tags, your Ontario plates - that's your choice, it makes you an easier target.

As a newcomer here you are apparently not aware that these changes are very recent and very abrupt. That is the rub. Mexico used to follow a very expat friendly approach, apparently it no longer wishes to do so. So you either roll with the punches or, as it seems at least some and maybe more than some are doing, stop coming or leave.

[Fred Habacht]

When western US towns outlawed guns on everyone's belts....they didn't do it slowly; when they stopped cattle runs through towns....they didn't do it slowly....when the US stopped people from just walking across the borders between the US and Canada....there was an uproar that it wasn't friendly anymore.....

No one likes to give up a habit or "right" that they have gotten used to......I heard that some "taggers" wonder why you and your group cover up their work.

When something or some habit has to be changed.....you go with it or you leave. You live here by the grace and favor of an independent government.....you don't want your auto rules changed, you don't like topes, you don't like the lake going down or up......there is the alternative of teaching Mexico a lesson by leaving....I think they will survive, with great sadness but they will make it!

[lcscats]

Hopefully Spencer will be able to discuss the notarized copy vs the actual immigrante card. After having my purse stolen once, I am NOT going to carry my original card. It is way too expensive and difficult to get a replacement.

Go get 'em Spencer.

Visa papers yes drivers lic/registration no copies allowed. No color copies in mexico EVER!

[ChrisB]

Remember when some official stopped dogs on flights? There was an uproar and the rule was changed back two weeks later. We just need to get to the right official and help him/er understand. They are probably totally unaware of the damage they are doing. Another town Topic needed at LCS!

[RVGRINGO]

Note that Mexico still makes it easy for tourists to visit, especially by air, and to spend big bucks during their short visits.

It is retired residents on limited incomes, backpackers sleeping on beaches, and others who do not spend much, who are the ones being systematically discouraged from coming to, or remaining in Mexico. We are an insignificant statistic in their economy.

[bwhite1948]

Note that Mexico still makes it easy for tourists to visit, especially by air, and to spend big bucks during their short visits.

It is retired residents on limited incomes, backpackers sleeping on beaches, and others who do not spend much, who are the ones being systematically discouraged from coming to, or remaining in Mexico. We are an insignificant statistic in their economy.

RV is right: expats have been deemed by the Mexican Federal government to be more trouble than we are worth to them.

However, locally here and in San Miguel and other expat hotspots, our demise will severely affect local economies as we fade away without replacements.

[ChrisB]

the baby boomers will come regardless. they will meet the requirements gladly.

[Mainecoons]

I have to agree with RV, it certainly appears to me that the priority is on short term visitors who pay gringo prices for hotels and meals in the resort cities. For the resident expat, the incentives have diminished significantly. Newcomers, assuming ChrisB is right, do not have to adjust to sudden rule changes and it is pretty clear what they have to do to come here.

It certainly seems the level of police protection here has gone up significantly and the number of serious crime incidences has decreased. For that we should be thankful.

[RVGRINGO]

That may be the case. The current newbies are more accustomed to regulation and high prices, and have made the incomes required to benefit from much higher Social Security incomes, as well as in their retirement pensions. Those of us oldies, who were middle management at less than $40,000 per year, and living well with wives who never had to work, are now on SS and pensions that barely pay for life in Mexico. We were the generation that grew up with free water, TV, radio, parks, $20k three bedroom homes on an acre, affordable medical treatment without insurance plans, etc. Then the world changed in the 60s and 70s. Yet, we came here 10-15 years ago and bought into the Mexican dream. Now, we must dispose of our cars, but cannot find a market for our real estate unless those baby boomers do come. I have not seen many lately and we are dying off faster than they are arriving.

The local economies, as mentioned above, will suffer. However, they too are a drop in the Mexican bucket. The government is developing more and more ocean-front destination resorts; usually not the places to which most retirees are attracted.

We are in no condition to drive our J-car to the border and already have a Jalisco car. So, the J-car will just sit. I am too blind to drive but my wife will now have to fight the Chapala drivers license challenge on her own. We would like to downsize, and planned to do so at some point, but it now looks unlikely. Life is getting complicated and we feel trapped, but sure cannot consider NoB.

[Mainecoons]

The climate?

We just don't know at this point if people will come in to replace those who are leaving for reasons which may or may not be related to all the abrupt changes and floundering about by INM and Aduana. What seems plain is that those "for sale" signs are proliferating and that there's a lot more slack in the rental market than there used to be.

It does appear, and some of my realtor friends confirm, that some of the slack is being taken up by Tapatios. I am told they are most interested in the cheaper properties at this point.

The wild card IMO is not that newcomers can handle the new rules, it is how the rather high income requirements will affect their decision to come at all. That is probably a wait and see situation at this point.